Well its getting to that time of year. The time where we separate the good blends from the summer time vacation fuel. This morning on my Edge monitor before I started the truck I saw it said 37*F. Now that's gettin down there and I had my worries.......Suspense?.... Fired right up. No more cranking time than normal. The same blend I have been using in the summer.

Now for the point of the discussion. I know we have talked about it before and we have posted our blends and vehicle types but seeing as how there are new people every day and I feel that it would be a nice gesture to get another in before winter fully hits. So.... Here goes....


Truck- 99 F250 7.3L psd

Blend- wvo/k1/rug 85/10/5 and a quarter gallon of turpentine to 50 gallons of mix with a double dose of cetane boost (diesel kleen)
(I know diesel kleen is not the best choice but I still have some left)

Winters gone through using it- This is my first winter. 37*F lowest temp.


Ok there's mine. If anyone else would like to join I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks.

I am anxious to see what people are using as well. I haven't been through a winter yet but our winters are mild here. I don't have a convenient source for K1 so I am hoping to use diesel and rug, the problem is that I have a heated system so I am afraid too much rug will cause vapor lock. Do I need the heat if I blend? I just figure every little bit helps.
Rusty

quote:

Originally posted by rtarh2o:
I have a heated system so I am afraid too much rug will cause vapor lock. Do I need the heat if I blend? I just figure every little bit helps.
Rusty

In my experience, heating certainly helps blends and RUG will cause vapor lock but ONLY if you use too much. 10% is fine in my vehicle with heat and my blend of preference is a 3 part: Wvo, Bio and RUG.
This winter I got by very nicely with 50% WVO, 40-45% B100 and 5-10% Rug.

Seems to me many people are far too cautious on the WVO. I appreciate some live in much colder climates than myself as well as driving different vehicles but I often see people are operating in the same sort of temps with the same vehicles and are barely using 20% WVO.

I'd suggest people test what works and don't be so afraid of going in a bit harder on the WVO side.

I'm surprised noone else has chimed in by now.

quote:

vanderchevy18
I'm surprised noone else has chimed in by now.

Hello vanderchevy18, yes I have noticed that this forum has gotten a lot slower since I left it in early August. Since you are on the topic of winter blends I thought some of you might like to look at these links on year round blending ratios:

General year round mixing recommendations
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/veggie_fuel_blennders/message/47
http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/forum/viewthread.php?tid=8758

Blending Recommendations chart
http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/oC_2SAl24A8c1NfyTsBv_AHDCQ...0recommendations.jpg

I normally go to No Florida to buy kerosene as in So Fl it is extremely diffucult to find. I go to Platka Fl and lEWIS PETROLEOUM as they sell it right out of a pump along with off-road and mineral spirits. Alas n o kero yet and they do not know when it would be avail. They explained that there supplier filled there kero tank with bio-diesel and they have not been able to sell it. They said come back in the end of November as thats when they should get there supply back in. I picked up 60 gal of off road and guess I will just increase my blend to 70/30 with some naptha and acetone mixed into each 5 gallon container. The summer mix was 90/10 with kero being the additive not off the road diesel.

WELL! Im at %60 WVO, %40 ulsd, 1/2 gal. RUG to 10gal.mix, also 2 oz,acetone,1 oz turp. shake it up pour into tank.
so far so good, cold morns around 40*-55* starts on 1st stroke but shakes rattles and rolls till it clears its throat, and smoke goes away, takes about 30 seconds. i can live with that! 97 GMC 6.5T burb no conversion.
Thx Ron

Ok now we're getting somewhere.

My truck burns %20 VO, 10% jetB, %70 ULSD, plus 0.2% acetone, 0.4 % turpentine.

On cold mornings around 25°F-35°F starts on 1st stroke and NEVER shakes, rattles, or smokes.

'89 Toyota 3.4L TDI; FPHE w/ plug-in preheat.

I haven't had any what I would call "cold" starts yet but I am running about a 60wvo/40diesel blend right now. We have had morings in the low 50's and it starts just like it did during the summer with no smoke and no rough idle. I have been using a coolant heated fuel filter but am considering removing it and adding a pretty good amount of rug when it starts getting colder to see what happens.
Rusty

Hi Rusty, I would agree that as the temperatures 32F (0C) one may find that using diesel as a thinning agent is no longer going to help for starting cold in the morning without a block heater. And, using RUG as the thinning agent might be wise, but kerosene (if it is legal where you live) will work as well (as John Gault has demonstrated).

On the coolant heated fuel filter causing vapor lock with RUG as a thinning agent:
Can you just valve it off instead of removing it? Maybe you will find that the heater will be needed under certain conditions.

A question for John.
Since you live in the tundra and you are using mixed VO-based fuels with kerosene as your method, have you tried seeing how cold you can get your mix to start your engine cold without the block heater and other heaters you use? I am a bit curious just how low a temperature cold starting with kerosene as a thinner will work at.

My mercedes starts good on V80/D20 down to 15F. Adding any amount of RUG doesn't make it start any better. Adding RUG lowers the power and MPG noticeably for me (compared to the D2 blend), 10% RUG=10% less power & MPG. Since its a non-turbo model, I really miss the power.

Note I don't run blend below 15F since that is the cloud point of the canola I am using, so it would clog my filter.

chevy.
Ive been expermenting with my blend and it is good to about 35 degrees. it stays liquid and starts on first round on a 50/50 mix blend and petrol diesel. NO SMOKE
when the temps drop into the 20s or lower I use a 30/70 and im good.
I do use more petrol in the winter "for a few months" but during the spring and summer I will go as much as 80% blend to 20% petrol. big savings as I fill up three times a week or more in the summer.
BTW
my guys in La have been runnig 100 % blend this summer with no problems. but will start adding pertol diesel in the coming months.

I like the idea of the heated filter mainly to help keep it clear from fats and pho's that might get through all my cleaning (doubtful but better safe than sorry) of the WVO. Once the filter gets hot is should melt anything in it and let it pass so any clogs would clear away with heat. I also don't want to loose any power either so maybe I should stay away from the rug. I know of one place to buy kerosene locally but it is way out of the way so diesel is the easiest option. How do you know when stations switch (or if they switch) to the winter diesel? I am in Texas so they may never switch. How much thinner is winter diesel?
Rusty

quote:

Note I don't run blend below 15F since that is the cloud point of the canola I am using, so it would clog my filter.

That's inconsistent with my empirical data [15°F is -9.5°C]


I suspect it's PHO and fats clogging the filter not a mix of clear canola and ULSD.

quote:

Originally posted by john galt:
I suspect it's PHO and fats clogging the filter not a mix of clear canola and ULSD.

No there are no PHO or fats in my canola, its unused (out of date for food use). Remember I am running 80% blends so thats not far off from your chart, within the normal variations of types of canola.

Most charts I have seen say that V100 canola has a CFPP (cold filter plugging point) of -1C, 20F, see this thread:
http://www.burnveg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=97&highlight=cfpp
Note the CFPP is the figure we want, not cloud point which is 5F higher. You must have a special type of canola if the cloud point of V100 is -17C rather than the average -4C.

OK, I see what you mean now. When you stated

quote:

I don't run blend below 15F

I didn't assume you were speaking of a specific blend, since I vary the blend percents with temperature.

quote:

A question for John.
Since you live in the tundra and you are using mixed VO-based fuels with kerosene as your method, have you tried seeing how cold you can get your mix to start your engine cold without the block heater and other heaters you use?

No. I haven't tried running my truck into a brick wall to determine the speed at which the bumper will fail either.
Not trying to be snide, I just don't see the point in screwing with something that ain't broke.

WELL! i cant explain this but my 82 Isuzu 1.8L starts on same mix as my suburban,6.5T, but no smoke at all, blend %60wvo,%%40 ulsd,1/2 galrug,10gal mix,acetone and turp like above thread, also suburban on %50-%50 starts fine and no smoke, but i aint saving much money.
by the way thats why im into alternative thing(the money),im retired on fixed income. in the heat of summer i have run %90-10 in Isuzu no probs.38-40mpg, now thats cool!
about the smoke when cold,between the two engines, all i can say it must be the combustion chamber shape,and the glows holding on low power for a few seconds longer.
Thx Ron

As far as heated fuel filters go I am wondering if my 7.3L's don't have one factory. I have run my engine for a couple minutes and shut it off and took out the filter and the fuel was damn hot. Now I can't think the thing was running long enough for the block to heat it up so what made it so hot? I hope 12voltdan chimes in. I'd like to know. Also if anyone knows please let me know this too. I got a batch of oil from someone and it was seperated. As in a reddish oil on the top half and a yellowish thicker stuff on the bottom. When I mix with k1 and rug it all blends together and all I get at the bottom is a little bit of crud. Not the origional half and half. Can anyone tell me why? Is it just two different oils or what?
Sorry didn't want to start a new thread just for a couple questions. Figured I'd just hijack one of my threads instead.

chevy.
I dont know about yor vehicle but my dodge has a heater in the filter from the factory. and when i asked the service mechanic at the dealership about block heaters he said I did not need them. He said my truck came with a fuel system heater in the tank. below 40 degrees it kicks on to warm the fuel.
Now what will they think of next.
I did have my filter wax up last winter in the low teens. that was using d S E and unsettled oil. why this happend with a supossed fuel heater I dont know. Maybe it was due to my trying the D S E brew at that time.