Howdy All!

1st off: I'm a newbie. Made my 1st batch of BD a few days ago using the Dr. Pepper method that turned out well and I'm ready to step up.

2ndly: I would like to thank all of those who participate and offer advice to all of us newbies...we'd all be lost w/o you.

So, onto the juice...after doing my research from each step necessary I've drawn up some comprehensive general plans for myself that I'd like to submit for the approval or degradation of those more well versed in the subject. I couldnt find "complete" plans anywhere to compare to so I hope these are in the ballpark. I'll be using an appleseed processor, picked up a 60 gal shorty water heater yesterday. Along with it will be 3 of the 55 gal polyurethane drums arranged as they are on my plans.

To the far right will be the fill tank. I plan to filter the WVO as I pour it in with a window screen or the like as well as a restaurant grade colander (assuming I can find one with the filtering characteristics needed).

From there it will be pumped into the reactor via a Northern Tools clear water pump...for whatever reason theirs is more than twice as powerful (720GPH vs. 330GPH) as the one from Harbor Freight both having a 1/2 HP motor. After the glycerin is drained off it will be pumped into a Standpipe Wash Tank.

The wash tank will have probably two 5" bubble stones, an aquarium heater, and some kind of mist wash system. My question here is, is it preferable to use hot or cold water? I will be building this setup in my garage and plan to plumb the mister into the connection for my washing machine for permanent water supply and therefore could use either one.

After the mist and bubble wash it will be pumped into the last tank for final drying and storage. I plan to just have an open top to help with drying but was wondering if this could cause problems with the BD absorbing moisture out of the air. Also, while its drying would it help to put the aquarium heater in that tank to keep warm? I would probably fashion some sort of cover if leaving it more than a day or two, once its fully dried, but dont plan to have to store it for more than two weeks as I'll be making just about as much as I use.

One final little addition I might make is to wire anything needing 110V to a set of light switches mounted on the base so as not needing to plug and unplug stuff all the time.

Let me know what y'all think.

Thx

Schematic2.JPG (47 KB, 150 downloads)

G'day Rockfrawg;
Welcome to the wonderful world of biodiesel.
The Northern Tool pump is of better quality, but if you have a couple extra bucks the B100Supply pump is better still.
Looking at your schematic I recognise it as being almost a copy of what I've done (see reactor set up linked in my sig), except for the settling tank between the reactor and wash tanks.
If you have the space (as you seem to have) sticking a settling tank between the reactor and wash tanks will help a great deal. Water heaters, for the most part do not drain completely clean, and so glycerine gets into the wwash cycle causing trouble. The use of a seperate settling tank with standpipe eliminates this as you draw from the Sp to the wash tank while the glyc is sitt8ing below the SP outlet level (I have a purge valve at the lowest point coming out of the standpipe's outlet to get any glyc that has settled into it). A seperate settling tank lets you produce a second batch on the heels of the first one effectively doubling your output capacity. Otherwise before you use the reactor again you have to wait for settling and draining to happen before you can make another batch.

Having the option, hot water is better than cold for washing.
With the addition of the seperate settling tank with standpipe you can dump the bubbler and light mister and go straight to a spray nozzle or industrial mister which will cut down your wash times considerably. Graydon has both types
The MistPro and WashPro (the one I use/used - I am going to ion resin exchange) is just below it.
If you want to see the sprayer in action visit my website and scroll down to washing. You have to have a complete reaction and assure yourself that no glycerine has gotten into the wash cycle.

My.02 and 1/2

Thx Legal...i took your advice and added a settling tank. Didnt understand what you meant by purge valve until after I got started processing the 1st batch, now I understand and those will be added.

I titrated the WVO to 5.5 so I added that to 7 since i'm using KOH (90% pure). The plan was to make a 120L batch but found out the hard way when adding the methanol that a 40 gal water heater doesnt hold 40 gal. I used the 80/20-80/20 method with a total of 25L of methanol and 1350g of KOH (20L/1080g-5L/270g). I added back the glycerol after the 2nd mixing with about 6L of water for a 5% prewash. Mixed for about 20 mins and sent to settling tank. Allowed to settle for a day and a half. Did a 3/27 test at 5/45 and passed.



drained off the glycerol and moved to wash tank. This is where I had a little complications. Washed with warm/hot water thru a 360 degree sprinkler head at about half power. I got kinda nervous when it looked like orange juice. I also ended up with a little bit of milky white stuff settling out so I drained most of it out and took a pic. After sitting all day it still hasnt settled. What might this be?



Let it settle overnight and went and got a bubbler (I know you dont think its necessary Legal but it helped clear up some of the white stuff). Let it bubble all day today and changed the wash water when I got home this evening. Ran some more wash water thru it and its still not "clear"...possibly b.c. of the large amount of KOH I used? It did separate pretty fast. Do I need to keep washing?



still trying to figure out what I'm going to do about drying it. I was planning on using the same tank for washing and drying but after this first little calamity realize I dont want to end up with excess water screwing up the drying process. So...I've gotta figure out how I want to setup my drying tank to be used for a filling station and plumb in the filter. Oh...that reminds me, I've been to Napa and called the Wix tech line and couldnt find a filter that filters anything better than 7 microns. The only one I have right now is the 10 micron Goldenrod (495 or 496...the one for fuel) and want to add another for peace of mind...anyone have any part numbers for filters/heads and where I might find them locally here in DFW?

I think thats about all for now...let me know what y'all think...i'm just letting the water settle out this evening (was going to bubble again overnight but the air lines came off the bubble rocks and I couldnt fish them out). I will worry about drying tomorrow.

THX

PS. sorry for the size of pics, my photo gallery no longer resizes them for me

quote:

Originally posted by rockfrawg:

PS. sorry for the size of pics, my photo gallery no longer resizes them for me

Rockfrawg, there should be a setting on the camera that allows for smaller size pictures. Ususally it is for e-mailing them. HTH

yes Joe, i know there is, thx...i prefer to keep them large for quality purposes...the gallery used to shrink them to medium sized pics automatically for linking purposes but someone's been screwing w/ the software...

anyone have any BD related input?

Outlook Express can shrink pics for email purposes. Right click on the pic (either open or a folder listing), choose "send to" and a little dialogue opens asking if you want to reduce the size. If yes, an email form opens up with the reduced picture as an attachment and from there you can open and save it.

I cant tell from your pic if there are three layers or two. The white stuff at the bottom, a thin red band in the middle, and is there something above that? If there's only two layers then the white is normal wash water, replace it with some fresh stuff.

Have you made any 1 litre batches as suggested at www.biodieselcommunity.org? Remember, bio-making is a long-distance race, not a sprint.

theres only the two layers...the white wash water and the little bit of BD that drained out with it...nothing above it. thats actually the case for both the 2nd and 3rd pics but the 3rd pic down is the one with hazy wash water i'm asking about. so I should keep washing?

yes, i made a couple 1 liter batches, a few 3 liters, and one 5 gallon before stepping up to this bigger setup that i'm trying to learn to use...it seems to be a broad learning curve.

i'm in no rush, just trying to make sure everything turns out the best that it can which is why i'm asking questions. input is greatly appreciated.

Thx.

Yeap, looks like you're on track. Good 3/27 result, first wash water full of soap, second and subsequent less so. The cloudiness is just the soap coming out...quite a surprise, isn't it? Keep going until the washwater is clear. Remember that if you overdose with KOH you just create more soap, so make sure your titration is correct. But I suspect what you're finding is that well-converted bio is a cinch to wash. Wait til you get a batch that doesnt fully convert..haha.

Thx Paulus....I ran through 2 more washes before the wash water cleared up and did one more just to be certain. I settled it overnight then transferred to the drying tank. let it settle overnight again just to make sure no more water settled out, which it didnt. Today I circulated it thru the drying tank w/ the NT 1" clear water pump using the crimped outlet method blowing down the side of the tank. It ran for about 6 hrs today with fan blowing down on it before it finally cleared up. I let it run for another couple of hours just to be sure it was fully dried. Heres what I ended up with:

post-drying 3/27 results...again using 5/45...settled for over an hour


red BD...

hope I dont get stopped by the staties and accused of running off-highway diesel

product in the drying tank is dark...cant see the bottom w/o a work lamp under the barrel

with light


without light


what do y'all think? is it ready to burn? are there any other tests i should do before putting it in the truck? I still need some advice on a second filter/head setup that will do better than the 10 microns of the goldenrod...input is appreciated.

oh...and here's some pics of the "finished" setup. still needs some tweaking but thats it more or less.

You can cut the drying time down if you drop a bucket heater in the bd and bring it up to 110/120 F.

Yup, I heated to 45C while circulating and then kept circulating until cold. By then it was completely dry.

A test. Take some dried BD in a small jar and stick it in the fridge overnight.If it stays clear it's dry.

Another test;take the same sample and stick it in the freezer with a thermometer in it and check it every 20 minutes or so (use a timer so you don't forget like I do and have to start over).This will give you the gel point, the point when the fuel thickens so that it will plug a filter.

Final filtering; I use twin 2 micron cans from CAT item number 1R-0749. They mount on any 1 1/14 threaded head like the Perma Cool or the Fleetguard as well as thw original Caterpillar one.

The Perma Cool head has a nice benefit in that you can bolt it to a wall or 2x4 whereas the others have to be supported from below. Any place that sells Caterpillar equipment has the filter cans, they are a high efficiency 2 micron rated filter, not "absolute" but by the time you've run the biodiesel through 2 of them the point is moot.

I couldn't see the bottom of my drying tank either, but I could see down into it several inches and with a light against the outer wall I could see down a foot or two. It looks like you've done a bang up job, you should be happy.

I knew heating would speed up the process, but need advice on how to heat the stuff up in a poly drum. my aquarium heater doesnt seem to be doing much.

Thx for the p/n Legal, i'll have to see if i can find one today.

I did the fridge test last nite, down to 37 degrees and its still clear. have to try the freezer test later today.


thx again for all the help

You can heat in the plastic drum by using a bucket heater or heat spear.

quote:

oh...and here's some pics of the "finished" setup. still needs some tweaking but thats it more or less

Looks like a fun setup. Can you label the drums from right to left please?

Just me but those methoxide tanks at eye level would scare me.

Bringing the methoxide containers down to pump level or just slightly higher (2" or so) would definetly be a lot safer.
I've used a poly drum for drying, including heat, for a couple years. My favorite heating equipment for this use is Joe_M's heat spear, although I modified it a bit for use in an open head drum with a stand so the element wouldn't be tempted to get too close to the bottom.
Heat Spear Modified.
You cannot leave this thing unattended though as there is no control for the heat. To keep it from tipping forward I used a couple of 2" iron bushings with a wire through them and hung them around the shaft and over the outside edge of the drum.I did the same thing with a couple T fittings for my second heat spear that I used in the wash tank. You can see that one on my webpage (linked in the sig line) still in the wash tank as washing is taking place. Works great !

quote:

Originally posted by Paulus:

quote:

oh...and here's some pics of the "finished" setup. still needs some tweaking but thats it more or less

Looks like a fun setup. Can you label the drums from right to left please?

left to right is drying, washing, settling, heater and WVO input tank

I did read the thread warning about putting the methoxide containers up high but dont really have any other place to put them...except maybe underneath everything.

Greetings,

I really like your version or modification that you made to the Heater Spear. I am going to make one like your version. I was wondering what sealant to use and if you just coat the threads or fill up the entire area inside with sealant? I also was wondering what do you do with the ground wire connection?

Thanks for your help.

quote:

Originally posted by Legal Eagle:
Bringing the methoxide containers down to pump level or just slightly higher (2" or so) would definetly be a lot safer.
I've used a poly drum for drying, including heat, for a couple years. My favorite heating equipment for this use is Joe_M's heat spear, although I modified it a bit for use in an open head drum with a stand so the element wouldn't be tempted to get too close to the bottom.
Heat Spear Modified.
You cannot leave this thing unattended though as there is no control for the heat. To keep it from tipping forward I used a couple of 2" iron bushings with a wire through them and hung them around the shaft and over the outside edge of the drum.I did the same thing with a couple T fittings for my second heat spear that I used in the wash tank. You can see that one on my webpage (linked in the sig line) still in the wash tank as washing is taking place. Works great !

All I used was teflon pipe tape, lots of it to get a good seal. I used it when water washing a drying but since I've moved to resin purification I use it for the demething tank. It's a great tool and easy to put together once you have Joe's bushing. I haven't bothered with the ground wire, just the two on the element and snipped th eother one flush.

quote:

I haven't bothered with the ground wire, just the two on the element and snipped th eother one flush.

BAD IDEA!
You can drill and tap a screw into the pipe to connect the ground wire to or use a clamp. It is an electrocution and fire hazard with out it. If there is a short you want the shortest path possible back to the panel to trip the breaker.
A GFCI protected circuit would also be a wise choice for the feed to it...
Jon