BIODIESEL & SVO DISCUSSION FORUMS





Sponsors    Biodiesel and SVO Forums Home    Forums  Hop To Forum Categories  Biodiesel  Hop To Forums  Biodiesel For Heating    Heating WVO with WVO
Page 1 ... 11 12 13 14 15 

Moderators: Shaun, The Trouts
Go
New
Find
Notify
Tools
Reply
  
Heating WVO with WVO
 Login/Join
 
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
lets here it


I second that motion. Tell all canolafunola. Always interested in ideas.


mathematical elegance -- desired result achieved with minimal complication
 
Location: Manchester UK | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
del


Ron
'85 300D
'83 300D
Since '80 former WVO conversions:
'83 240D
'80 Audi 4000D
'83 Isuzu Pup
'86 Golf
'76 Honda Civic with Kubota engine
Several generators
Kubota Tractor
 
Location: NY | Registered: November 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
I haven't been here much but I'm here now. Smile

Fuel level control:

The way Mobius was controlling the level is very clever but from what I read is also very sensitive. I was thinking of a tube within a tube where the inner concentric tube is for the air and the outer makes up the reservoir for the oil. More oil is fed to the reservoir than is consumed so it has to spill into a sump. Level can be controlled by raising or lowering either the inner or outer tube.

I made a prototype and will be testing it with water first (to observe the fog).


ps. I will be using HHO burner nozzles for a jet. I measured a .75 gph nozzle to have an opening of approx .009., a .90 gph approx .01. I will try bigger and smaller nozzles and see what they'll do. Burner nozzles are cheap and easy to get locally.

quote:
Originally posted by Ant:
quote:
lets here it


I second that motion. Tell all canolafunola. Always interested in ideas.
 
Registered: May 08, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
canolafunola,
Try this - take a 2"x1" piece of box section about a foot long, laid narrow side up. In th middle of it slice off a piece of the top surface, about 2" long. At one end, create a dam of about 1/2" by welding on small wall. At the other end, block it up and feed in oil from a pump. At the dam end, arrange a drainage pipe back to a sump the pump is fed from.

Ok, the tube would be filled with a regular steady flow of oil which is at a contant level.

You see where I'm going with this?

Under the cutout section would be an air nozzle of the approximate 10thou size being fed with ~80psi air, pointing up just like in mobius1's design. The height of the wall and the oil flow can be varied until a good compromise is reached.

A spray of oil, regulated level. No farting around with buckets and hooky levelling devices.


Kilkenny, Ireland.
Turk burner workshop heater using chip fat to heat bulk tank and feed house rads.
 
Registered: June 29, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
The height of the wall and the oil flow can be varied until a good compromise is reached.


How would you vary the hight of the wall? It can need changing if your fuel changes. Why a foot long?


mathematical elegance -- desired result achieved with minimal complication
 
Location: Manchester UK | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by canolafunola:
I haven't been here much but I'm here now. Smile

Fuel level control:

The way Mobius was controlling the level is very clever but from what I read is also very sensitive. I was thinking of a tube within a tube where the inner concentric tube is for the air and the outer makes up the reservoir for the oil. More oil is fed to the reservoir than is consumed so it has to spill into a sump. Level can be controlled by raising or lowering either the inner or outer tube.

I made a prototype and will be testing it with water first (to observe the fog).


ps. I will be using HHO burner nozzles for a jet. I measured a .75 gph nozzle to have an opening of approx .009., a .90 gph approx .01. I will try bigger and smaller nozzles and see what they'll do. Burner nozzles are cheap and easy to get locally.

quote:
Originally posted by Ant:
quote:
lets here it


I second that motion. Tell all canolafunola. Always interested in ideas.


If you made a tube in tube in tube (3), you could catch the oil from the outside tube and re-route it back to a sump. would work fine in a gravity fed setup, where one couldn't have the sump directly under the burner.


Be the change you hope to find in this world.-Gandhi

 
Location: location, location... | Registered: November 04, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post



Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Ant:
quote:
The height of the wall and the oil flow can be varied until a good compromise is reached.


How would you vary the hight of the wall? It can need changing if your fuel changes. Why a foot long?

Make different ones to suit. The foot long is just a starting point. It might be useable with only four inches, who knows? I intend to try this out soon. I also see how it can be made very squat. Futher refinements can be made along the road, such as proper drain arrangement and a flame trap (such as found in crankcase ventilation sytems of old). If this device is run on WVO, I don't think the flashpoint of the fuel is an issue, but diesel might be a different matter. Sump drainage systems on horizontal Babbingtons have, as far as I know, not led to any workshops burning down, but it's best to avoid it if possible Smile


Kilkenny, Ireland.
Turk burner workshop heater using chip fat to heat bulk tank and feed house rads.
 
Registered: June 29, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by canolafunola:
<snip>
ps. I will be using HHO burner nozzles for a jet. I measured a .75 gph nozzle to have an opening of approx .009., a .90 gph approx .01. I will try bigger and smaller nozzles and see what they'll do. Burner nozzles are cheap and easy to get locally.


I think you will find oil nozzles great for a vertical Babington. I found a hollow pattern works better and uses less air than a solid one. It's best to remove the filter because any oil that backflows into the nozzle will restrict the air flow.


Ron
'85 300D
'83 300D
Since '80 former WVO conversions:
'83 240D
'80 Audi 4000D
'83 Isuzu Pup
'86 Golf
'76 Honda Civic with Kubota engine
Several generators
Kubota Tractor
 
Location: NY | Registered: November 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
By all means try it out and post your results. I have not had time to work on mine. Once I make some progress, I'll post about it. Maybe some pics too.

quote:
Originally posted by Transit Dave:
quote:
Originally posted by Ant:
quote:
The height of the wall and the oil flow can be varied until a good compromise is reached.


How would you vary the hight of the wall? It can need changing if your fuel changes. Why a foot long?

Make different ones to suit. The foot long is just a starting point. It might be useable with only four inches, who knows? I intend to try this out soon. I also see how it can be made very squat. Futher refinements can be made along the road, such as proper drain arrangement and a flame trap (such as found in crankcase ventilation sytems of old). If this device is run on WVO, I don't think the flashpoint of the fuel is an issue, but diesel might be a different matter. Sump drainage systems on horizontal Babbingtons have, as far as I know, not led to any workshops burning down, but it's best to avoid it if possible Smile
 
Registered: May 08, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
I think you will find oil nozzles great for a vertical Babington. I found a hollow pattern works better and uses less air than a solid one. It's best to remove the filter because any oil that backflows into the nozzle will restrict the air flow.


Thanks Ron. I will try both hollow and solid patterns. What about the fuel distributor with the metering slots? Do you leave that in? I am gonna try it both ways and see what the effects are.
 
Registered: May 08, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
The metering slots is what makes for a wider fog and a shorter flame. I keep it in.


Ron
'85 300D
'83 300D
Since '80 former WVO conversions:
'83 240D
'80 Audi 4000D
'83 Isuzu Pup
'86 Golf
'76 Honda Civic with Kubota engine
Several generators
Kubota Tractor
 
Location: NY | Registered: November 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
I'll be able to make a start on this soon; the HHO nozzle idea is good - I've got a lot of them kicking around from servicing oil burners.


Kilkenny, Ireland.
Turk burner workshop heater using chip fat to heat bulk tank and feed house rads.
 
Registered: June 29, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post



Member
posted Hide Post
A version of murphys grease burner.
 
Location: West Michigan | Registered: April 26, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by fabricator:
A version of murphys grease burner.


What a boring video!!! Do you have any high quality closeup pics of your burner? That'd be a lot more interesting! Smile
 
Registered: May 08, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Make different ones to suit.



Swap out the burner head every time you change fuel? I can't see me doint that. How would you fine tune it?

The idea from canolafunola of adjusting the hight of a tube seems more practical to me. Not too hard to do if you think about pipe fittings and how they go together.

Fine adjustment of the relationship between the air jet and the level of the pool is one of the requirements of a vertical babington.


mathematical elegance -- desired result achieved with minimal complication
 
Location: Manchester UK | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
member
posted Hide Post
Jets -- I also have read on other sites of folks using the screw-in standard home heating oil burner nozzles for there jet in burners of Mobiuse's design, I have measured the smaller flowrate versions of these (.75 - .50 and less G/H) using piano wire throught the opening, I forget the measurments just now but the diameter of the opening gets smaller as the flow rate gets smaller, some were even smaller than 10 thousanths. By removing the internal swirl device you end up with a nice calibrated opening, removing it makes a longer narrower flame, leaving it in makes a shorter wider flame. Hollow cone seems best as the oil around the outer edge of the opening is all that should be picked up by the air to make the smallest droplets anyway. The hollow cone nozzles have a tiny pin mounted on the internal insert, this pin stickes up through the center of the round orifice hole and keeps air from flowing there, this reduces the air required and also causes the air velocity at the edge of the orifice opening to be higher with a bit less air pressure than with a solid cone nozzle, higher velocity air makes smaller fuel droplets, smaller fuel droplets take less heat to vaporize so are easier to light and keep lit.

These nozzles are also being used by folks as the ball oriface in there small home-built horizontal babington heaters. Airtronics makes a commercial babington style burner (discussion here) used by the U.S. Marines that uses two small ball orifices in a very compact and reliable horizontal burner, unfortunatly it is not available to the public.
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
member
posted Hide Post
Interesting thread.

Aside from purchase cost and the lack of challenge/adventure, what do you people think/feel about this burner system?:

www.kingbuilt.com
 
Registered: September 26, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
Hi Welder,

Well built unit but since it uses boiler water as the primary heat for the waste oil, it is much better suited for WMO than WVO.


Ron
'85 300D
'83 300D
Since '80 former WVO conversions:
'83 240D
'80 Audi 4000D
'83 Isuzu Pup
'86 Golf
'76 Honda Civic with Kubota engine
Several generators
Kubota Tractor
 
Location: NY | Registered: November 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post



Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Ron Schroeder:
Hi Welder,

Well built unit but since it uses boiler water as the primary heat for the waste oil, it is much better suited for WMO than WVO.
Please explain why you feel boiler water to heat the fuel is not the way to go with veg fuels?

Also..... this unit im fairly positive is a boiler heating system anyway. It heats the room via radiators releasing heat generated by the boiler.


_________________________
If you believe you can't YOUR RIGHT;

But equally so.... if you believe you can, YOUR RIGHT as well.
 
Location: North Tx | Registered: November 23, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
Hi George,

WMO can atomize well at 160 degrees. WVO needs to be hotter to atomize as well. If you are using boiler water to heat up your fuel, it can not get any hotter than the boiler water. While WVO will burn at lower temperatures, I have found most veggie oils will burn cleaner and ignite more reliably if heated to over 210 degrees. I run about 250 degrees.


Ron
'85 300D
'83 300D
Since '80 former WVO conversions:
'83 240D
'80 Audi 4000D
'83 Isuzu Pup
'86 Golf
'76 Honda Civic with Kubota engine
Several generators
Kubota Tractor
 
Location: NY | Registered: November 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
  Powered by Social Strata Page 1 ... 11 12 13 14 15  
 

Sponsors    Biodiesel and SVO Forums Home    Forums  Hop To Forum Categories  Biodiesel  Hop To Forums  Biodiesel For Heating    Heating WVO with WVO

© Maui Green Energy 2000 - 2014