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Canola biodiesel and ASTM testing
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It has been suggested that a single base stage reaction using canola oil cannot create biodiesel that passes the ASTM total glyceride test.
I have passed the phlip test using a single base stage (NAoH) with canola WVO but am wondering if anyone has any GC test data to back up or refute the above claim?
Thanks,
Jon
 
Location: Wellington County, Ontario Canada | Registered: February 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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It has been suggested that a single base stage reaction using canola oil cannot create biodiesel that passes the ASTM total glyceride test.


By whom and with what testing to support?


Andrew

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Location: Northern California | Registered: February 27, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Location: Wellington County, Ontario Canada | Registered: February 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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-The question I put to the Dr. was is the 3/27 test reliable /accurate in determining whether or not the biodiesel will pass astm for glycerids. ( this is an assumption I had from my many years hanging out on this board) The answer not if the biodiesel is made from canola. He said they have more GC failures from canola based biodiesel unless it is processed single stage with a planned repo. And went on to explain about the fatty acid in canola that needs a harder kick to convert. This does not happen with the 80/20 process, and the reason they had many GC failures. The single stage process produces more passes, but to be sure of a pass every time! Do a planned repo at the end of the single base stage.
-I like most of you don’t have access to a GC machine, but I am always interested in trying different processes. I processed as instructed, and have never looked back, the 3/27s are a clear pass 4/27/even 6/27 which only means there are no triglycerides since mono and diglycerides are soluble in biodiesel.
-probably not a big deal to have mono and di in the biodiesel for most home brewers, hell look at how many people burn svo!! On the other hand there are others who want to make astm quality biodiesel.
-I offer this info as it was offered to me, your choice whether to believe it or not, as I said this is my process now, and I know reece also follows the process with great results.
-A few days ago there was another thread Damn canola or something to that effect, where the process was changed If I remember correctly 80/20 to 66/33 and the person could not pass GC for monoglycerids. We have spoken off thread, it will be interesting to see his results when he changes to this process Tom
Tom


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Location: Manitoba Canada | Registered: March 24, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Inland Empire Oilseed (Odessa, Washington) make "ASTM" biodiesel from their locally grown Canola and Camelina using single-stage processing. They perform their own QC tests in-house, using their own GC and some other lab equipment. I'm not aware of them doing any 3/27 tests.

Cheers,
JohnO
 
Location: Moses Lake, WA, USA | Registered: August 15, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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See HERE.


Jon,

Just because one or a few are having a hard time does not mean that it is impossible.

Lots of ASTM passing fuel (re FTG test) has been made using single stage. If you want to do it start with very dry oil, enough catalyst and 25% methanol. Use a long run time in a closed vessel. Slam dunk.

If you are recovering, then 25% is a good way to go anyway. The excess methanol will push the reaction, just like in 2 stage.


Andrew

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Location: Northern California | Registered: February 27, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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If you use excessive amounts of methanol (25% or more), where does this methanol end up? IN the glycerine of the bio or a combination of the two.
 
Location: smithville flats, ny | Registered: August 28, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I cannot agree or disagree with this statement about canola and 2 stage having never used it as we have rapeseed instead, but I must admit I've never heard of this before.

Most of the excess methanol above the stoichiometric amount needed will end up in the glycerine, with probably less than 5% ending up in the bio.


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Location: S.E. England | Registered: September 05, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Thanks Tom!
Andrew, I agree however I am looking for some GC test results to confirm this. I use 22% methanol single base stage and would wager that I can pass the ASTM standard but I am too cheap to get it GC tested! Razz
Chug, I believe rapeseed is canola.
Jon
 
Location: Wellington County, Ontario Canada | Registered: February 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by Chug:
I cannot agree or disagree with this statement about canola and 2 stage having never used it as we have rapeseed instead, but I must admit I've never heard of this before.

Most of the excess methanol above the stoichiometric amount needed will end up in the glycerine, with probably less than 5% ending up in the bio.


For the purpose of making biodiesel canola = rapeseed When I was a kid the name was rapeseed, but in this modern world of political correctness it was renamed canola. There used to be a sign outside a small town in Saskatchewan "Land of Rape and Honey", but I think it is gone now.
 
Location: Winnipeg, MB | Registered: July 31, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Canola is a hybrid variety of rape seed, they are not the same thing, it was developed in Canada that's where the Can comes from, it was developed to produce a more palatable oil, Can adian Oil seed Low Acid, Canola. Rape is a very high acid seed making it very bitter, it was originally cultivated to make oil for steam engine lubrication.
 
Location: West Michigan | Registered: April 26, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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yeah I believe Canola is GM rapeseed, I read somewhere they lowered the erucic acid content to make it better for cattle, I would imagine they behave pretty much the same, the high the erucic acid content is what helps give it good clodflow properties, so lowering it may raise it's melting point, although never having compared them I don't know.


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Location: S.E. England | Registered: September 05, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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With a good strong pump from Grainger and an hour's run time at 140 degrees, I've had no problem passing 3/27 at merely 20% methanol...in fact was getting ready to play around with 19%...then 18% if that works...seeing as that's the expensive part.
 
Registered: October 27, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by fabricator:
Canola is a hybrid variety of rape seed, they are not the same thing, it was developed in Canada that's where the Can comes from, it was developed to produce a more palatable oil, Can adian Oil seed Low Acid, Canola. Rape is a very high acid seed making it very bitter, it was originally cultivated to make oil for steam engine lubrication.



Cool, a quick scan of Wiki confirms what you say. Nowdays the EU won't eat our Canola because it is GMO, but they like it for biodiesel.

From Wikipedia:
Canola is one of two cultivars of rapeseed or Brassica campestris (Brassica napus L. and B. campestris L.). Canola was originally naturally bred from rapeseed in Canada. The negative associations due to the homophone "rape" resulted in creation of the more marketing-friendly name "Canola". The change in name also serves to distinguish it from regular rapeseed oil, which has much higher erucic acid content.
 
Location: Winnipeg, MB | Registered: July 31, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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