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Hello hiperf2007
The BioPro seems to be quite safe and it uses stir mixing. Most reactors that uses a pump for mixing seem to use a poor quality pump that was not designed to pump caustic chemicals and has a history of failing and catching fire. Saint Tilly |
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hiper
you failed to mention about water testing and dewatering as well as the importance of getting food/batter chunkies completely out. I mention this because there have been no less than 20 people or so in the last month who have had messed up batches and/or emulsions because of excess water. On the subject of pumps. It is not terribly expensive to purchase a 1 hp motor - they can be had for about 85 dollars and a gear pump - can be had for under 200 dollars. I realize that's more than the 30 or 35 bucks that people pay for the harbor freight jobbie, but given the cost of diesel right now and the amount saved per batch it only takes 1 or 2 batches to pay for a far superior setup. Which will result in greater reliability as well as better mixing which will aid the process. |
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Use two Clear Water Pumps in parallel. Much less expensive than other pump options, and it will most likely eliminate the over amping reliability problem during mixing.
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It could also be mentioned that just searching through the archives will likely reveal the answer. Doing a little leg/ finger work goes a long way.
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Hello John
Can you please explain how hooking two Clear Water pumps in Parallel will "eliminate the over amping reliability problem during mixing" Saint Tilly |
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Tilly, I am talking about the people that try to do this in a 5 gallon bucket and a wood stick. Some people might try and jump into this to fast and get blown up.. Just some things to think about and yes, the wood stick has been done. I have people PM me asking my why that was not working...  I should of added there are TONS of forums on this site explaining anything and everything you could want to know, but the far best is all the people here to help and response to questions. You guys rock.  2006 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9L Turbo Diesel Fuel Blends, Recorded Miles Diesel: 30194 B20: 978 B40: 447 B60: 2167 B80: 1673 B100: 1239 |
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Hello hiperf2007
Oh, you mean David Hill'sWorld Famous Flat Stick Technique (Pat Pend)Yes, that has been around about as long as the World Famous Dr Pepper Technique (Pat Pend) He used to do production batches in a cement mixer but one day he had to leave his cement mixer on the job and the last I knew Dave had upsized his World Famous Flat Stick Technique (Pat Pend) and reacts in a 200 litre drum mixing with a 1X2 flat Stick. By the way, can you think of a reason why two Water Pumps in parallel will "eliminate the over amping reliability problem during mixing" It does not add up to me. Saint Tilly |
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This has been discussed in detail before on this forum and is also available through Google. Two pumps in parallel share the load and increase the flow or head as much as 30% depending on the pump curves and the operating head. It's a common practice in the HVAC industry, and avoids the problem of oversized pumps for intermittent high viscosity loads, or when higher flow is needed for heating at extreme cold temperatures. It also provides a standby pump should one fail. |
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Flat stick in an OPEN barrel????
I am not saying it won't work. What was his methanol exposure? Granted, I think the "methanol exposure" phobia is over rated. However, mixing hot oil with methoxide in an open top barrel.... well.... Did he ever talk about his headaches or blurred vision? . C. Pump and Heater controllers are a must have. (ask Tilly why) 2006 - Jeep Liberty CRD - Wife drives - 1983 - Mercedes 300SD - Veggie experiment car "Casper" 2006 - Toyota Sienna - Mine :-( Hey, it's a comapny car! |
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Hmm so you "pump" 35gall (I guess that is US galls so in real talk it is 130 Ltrs) for 2hrs at 135 degress (read approx 57 Deg C).. Two things jump out at Me here !. most of the failed batches and problem batches I see on here are in the "appleseed " type reactors and usually are the result of under mixing ..ie the use of pump to mix ..and 2. at 57 deg C if you were to MIX ie stir you only have to stir for approx 50 mins hence a huge waste of energy. I agree care has to be taken and a properly designed plant that has a stir rather than a pump to mix is as safe as the appleseed design. It would appear the only real reason for a closed system like an appleseed is so higher presures therefore higher temps there fore less mixing time is required The plant I have is closed (no not sealed ) and I process at 55 deg for 45 Mins and also pass 3/27 test religiously ... the point of My comment is ... there is NOT a single way that is the best to process ..it just depends on the things you wish to gain from the bio experience ..personally I wish to make cheek GOOD fuel safely and to be aware of energy and enviroment concerns ...regards Kev
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Hello John
Can you give me a link to where this has been discussed n this forum, I have had a look and can not find it. Do you mean that 2 pumps would only result in a 30% increase in flow rate compared to a single pump? It would seem to me that as there is no controller on the pump, each pump would continue to run as normal and the only reason you would not be pumping twice the volume is if it were constricted by the size of the delivery or discharge pipe, And in some situations this could result in overheating. Or do you mean that there will be double the flow rate plus 30%? Do you feel this applies to biodiesel production in most situations? If you do, Can you explain where and when this would be applicable for biodiesel production As most of the overheat/fire problems seem to occur when the capacitor blows or the rotor jams do you think a second pump would have any affect on the temperature of the failed pump? Saint Tilly |
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This should answer your questions. I found the link, and here's the message.
Parallel pumps with check valves to prevent back flow are quite common in commercial applications  http://www.bellgossett.com/Press/BG-unparallel.asp As the graph shows, flow will increase by about 112% and head (pressure) will increase by about 140% in the example shown. Specific applications will vary. The caps on the CW pumps fail because the pumps frequently push their amp limits when starting to mix thick VO while it's reacting with methoxide or starting with cold VO. Running two in parallel during these stages would likely significantly extend pump life and reduce the over-amp overheating problem. |
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Hello John
Can you provide the link to the thread. Is the graph you have displayed to the HF clearwater pump? Saint Tilly |
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Just to clarify... In the case of the HF pump, the capacitor is a start capacitor and can blow or even be removed while the pump is running with no ill effect to the pump... It will just not start again without some help... Jon |
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.......... or, may start turning in the oppsite direction no? Starter caps have a + and a - to them so they "push" the windings in the proper direction. . C. Pump and Heater controllers are a must have. (ask Tilly why) 2006 - Jeep Liberty CRD - Wife drives - 1983 - Mercedes 300SD - Veggie experiment car "Casper" 2006 - Toyota Sienna - Mine :-( Hey, it's a comapny car! |
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Carl,
No this is incorrect. The start caps on an AC motor are not polarized(+ or -) If a DC cap is used you will be in for a big surprise... BANG.!!! Once the motor starts turning the Start Capacitor has no effect whatsoever... Its strictly to start the motor. In laymen terms the capacitor provides a delay in the power given to one of the windings. This delay causes the magnetic forces of the motor to be unbalanced and the motor then starts to turn in the direction of the weakest pole. Jon |
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Tilly, You never commented on this post. Isn't there someone else that has a "canoe paddle" method (pat. pending) that mixes like less than 15 min??? Physical agitation is the best way to get the little molecules striking into each other. So, why not pump, yes pump the oil through an inline heater (static mixer) and introduce the methoxide via venturi (high surface area ratio due to the small(ish) volume of oil speeding through the narrow passage; Then splash it into the tank where it is sucked through the pump and forcesd through the static mixer (heating element) on its way once again to be bombarded again with the methoxide through the venturi. Or, dump the methoxide into an open 55 gallon drum that contains your heated oil, mix it with a canoe paddle for 15 min or so, get a headache, have a few beers to make the headache go away and call it a day... . C. Pump and Heater controllers are a must have. (ask Tilly why) 2006 - Jeep Liberty CRD - Wife drives - 1983 - Mercedes 300SD - Veggie experiment car "Casper" 2006 - Toyota Sienna - Mine :-( Hey, it's a comapny car! |
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Aiiyyyeee... Sorry Jon. I meant this:
Sorry, I didn't mean a DC cap. The Vodka is kicking in.... methanol exposure is treated though. . C. Pump and Heater controllers are a must have. (ask Tilly why) 2006 - Jeep Liberty CRD - Wife drives - 1983 - Mercedes 300SD - Veggie experiment car "Casper" 2006 - Toyota Sienna - Mine :-( Hey, it's a comapny car! |
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Hello Carl
Dhill last posted to this forum 26 Dec. 2007 so he was alive at that point. I never heard him talk about any concerns. He also did not wash his biodiesel and at times he said that he would make biodiesel this morning and have it in the car this afternoon. Yes, Steve has a Canoe Paddle processor that is "Fumeless". I have not followed it's development since he left this forum.    Having a few beers is always a good idea. Saint Tilly |
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Sponsors Biodiesel & SVO Home Biodiesel & SVO Forums Making Biodiesel Noobs - Things to fallow before reposting questions.
Biodiesel & SVO Home Biodiesel & SVO Forums Making Biodiesel Noobs - Things to fallow before reposting questions.© Maui Green Energy 2000 - 2008