Either way, whether it makes soap or not, in my experience it has lowered the titration and increased the yield every single time.
There may be other benefits as well, like lower gel temps lower filter plugging temps and no white fall out. See THESE experiments from Wayne Seymour.
So while pretreatment may not produce the same yield as an AE I would certainly not discredit it as a waste of time! As it does work to lower the titration a couple of points and increase yield, regardless of how that is achieved it works as advertised.
Cheers,
Jon

This is a great conversation about improving conversion, but please do not hijack the thread. Perhaps create a new one? "% Yield improvement methods?"

Thanks
Doug

quote:

Originally posted by Doug Weiner:
This is a great conversation about improving conversion, but please do not hijack the thread. Perhaps create a new one? "% Yield improvement methods?"

Thanks
Doug

Agreed Doug,
I deleted my irrelevent post.
Another thread for glycerine pretreat yield has been started, I moved it over there.

last batch hit the storage tank at 35 gals
here how it went
40 gals wvo soy t=3
pretreat with 9 gals glycern 4 hrs mix/ heat to 140% 4 hrs settle
t=1.5ish but round to 2 for good measure
42gals
added 9gals meth. 1635 koh
processed 3 hrs (lots of yard work)
blow the doors off the 27/3
4 washes 1 static 3 mist
i always drain off extra wash/ bio and save it for what i call free range bio so i would say 2-3gals per run and end up with a 40 batch the free range bio i did from last yr passed 27/3 so no reprocess needed
long post final numbers
40 gals pretreated
35gals in the finished tank
2-3 gals free range bio in wash water tank as bonus
87.5 percent or 95 percent if you count free range bio

Interesting thread.

. Dewater 140 litres of wvo over night in gl.
. Oil normally titrates at 3.5 and i have a base of 7.5 koh. And use 30 litres of meth.
. takes 5 mins to put meth in then an hour later a perfect pass. then add 10 litres water.
. After 2 hours of settling i drain of 40 litres give or take a litre.
. proceed to demeth were i will get about 4 litres out.

140 litres of oil in.
135 litres of bio out.

Since adding my new pump this is. Before when i was using just the little pump i was getting a very poor 65% yeild.

For info on the pumps i have put a link to my design. http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/ev...=742107412#742107412

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Tom82,

34 Gallon WVO Soy
Titrated at 2.5
20% Methanol added (26 liters 6.9 Gallons). New Methanol, 99% pure
10+2.5g for 12.5 grams for 1625grams KOH
Water content of WVO was 610ppm tested via Sandy Brae

Processing temp 135F
Did 80/20.
Passes 27/3 first time
Processing time 80% for 90 minutes
Settle for 20 minutes and drained 4.5 Gallons of Glyc
Processing time of 20% 2 hours
Let sit overnight

Used vacuum to suck up the drained glycerin back into the processor.
De-methed both glyc and bio together via vacuum and heat. No circulation. Heat range 130-190 over a few days (I was conducting soap tests along the way.)
Eventually recovered 5 Liters of methanol. Should have be able to recovered 9.75 Liters
Unknown Methanol amount lost to atmosphere via Vacuum pump. At least 400ml. (it was in my vacuum pump oil.)
Another amount lost to atmosphere (on purpose) to get bio to have less than .01% Methnaol

In the end with no wash done:
~6.5 Gallons of Glycerine
~33 Gallons of Bio
~ 5 Liters of Methanol recovered (1.3 Gallons).
~ 128ppm soap still to be removed via wood chips or resin.


Doug

Good batch there Doug

93 to 97%

14 Batches now have yieled from 93 to 97%

100 Liters WVO
1.5 to 3 Titration
19 Liters Total Meth (=19%)
2 Reactions 80/20% Meth, 90/10% KOH
3 Spray mist water washings, 11 to 12 gallons each wash
12 hour drying with heat, pump and fan