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Anyone converted a W210? (96-99 E300).
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quote:
I seem to have some kind of air infiltration on the diesel side -- something I've really looked for and can't locate. I can see the bubbles (and feel them), but not sure from where they originate in the system, as I have no fuel leaks.

They won't necessarily show as fuel leaks because they're on the suction side of pumps.
If you can see the bubbles, try spraying WD40 on each fitting starting with the inlet to the fuel pump and work back to the tank spraying and watching for the bubbles to reduce or stop. Some have used an unlit propane torch, but it takes some time for LPG sucked in to get to the cylinder and increase the RPM a bit.

Diesel is a bit more expensive here with the lowest diesel at the NorthPole refinery at $4.58, up to $6.58 per gallon at Bethel. Regular is 20 cents cheaper.. not much difference.



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hi John,

I've wondered about doing something like this, but I'd have to run the engine with the manifold pulled, right? I'm assuming that's OK, just taking super care not dropping something in there of course. Will it throw a CEL?

Thanks,

Chuck
 
Registered: December 30, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by carl6405:
What the heck is water injection?

Well simply, "Injecting Water" into your intake tract. The purpose is typically for intercooling. As many of you may remember from Chemistry class in school, Water exists in three phases. Solid,Liquid,Gas. In order to change from one phase to another energy is removed or added to exite or relax molecules.
For our purpose here, water in the liquid phase is injected where it meets a column of rapidly moving air that atomizes the liquid. The air is also over 250*F, so the tiny water particles absorb heat energy increasing temp past 212*F in order to change phase to gas. The air charge would effectively see a massive loss in temperature as heat energy was absorbed to phase change the liquid to gas.

Side benefit of this is the greater presence of Oxygen, needed for combustion. Cooler air expands more rapidly, making more power, combustion is more efficient with more oxygen.

If more water is injected than can phase change, this will remain as vapour or steam and provide the cleaning effect also mentioned.



quote:
Originally posted by carl6405: I found a link about it. This looks pretty crazy.
http://www.vegetableoildiesel....095&action=printable

He's injection water straight in to his turbo. I don't understand.

Note to all: Injecting water "pre-turbo" has potential to cool the compressor as well as reduce air charge temp, but in order to avoid damage to the fins of the compressor, the water must be an ULTRA fine mist. This typically requires 100psi water pressure into several ultra fine misting nozzles.
The larger water mist particles will cavitate the compressor wheel.

Check this out.
http://www.dieselbombers.com/g...urbo-water-meth.html



quote:
Originally posted by ChuckDubDub:
I've been running a WVO 2 tank hose-in-hose system on my E300 for a little over a year now. ... Anyway, they had to pull the head and send to a machine shop, but in the mean time did a valve job. The valve flutes had a good bit of sticky residue on them. Do you suppose water injection would help with this? I'm just not sure if the cleaning action would get to the valves.

-Chuck

Water Injection should minimize this issue.



quote:
Originally posted by ChuckDubDub:
I've done some blending, and honestly the only down side I know is that it can tend to clean the gunk out of the diesel system and clog up filters.

Burning too much cold VO will increase ring coking issues. Be very careful with blends.



quote:
Originally posted by ChuckDubDub:My car currently runs much smoother on the WVO system,

NOte: Your motor isnt running "Smoother". It is simply not "knocking" due to improper injection timing for VO. This is fine, but important to note that when injection timing is optimized for VO, the knocking will return. No need to optimize for VO (do so if you wish), but just note, the motor is not "running smoother". You changed fuels, and didnt tune for it. (I dont tune for it either).


quote:
Originally posted by ChuckDubDub: though I seem to have some kind of air infiltration on the diesel side -- something I've really looked for and can't locate. I can see the bubbles (and feel them), but not sure from where they originate in the system, as I have no fuel leaks. I've just lived with it for now.

Dont "live with it" Check each connection point to make sure it is tight, sealing properly. Air is getting in somewhere and will kill your performance eventually leading to a rough start. Note that any system in "suction" leaks in air. Systems under pressure, leak outward. This is why you see no leaks.



quote:
Originally posted by john galt:
quote:
I seem to have some kind of air infiltration on the diesel side -- something I've really looked for and can't locate. I can see the bubbles (and feel them), but not sure from where they originate in the system, as I have no fuel leaks.

They won't necessarily show as fuel leaks because they're on the suction side of pumps.
If you can see the bubbles, try spraying WD40 on each fitting starting with the inlet to the fuel pump and work back to the tank spraying and watching for the bubbles to reduce or stop..


Good advice. I'd assume a helper is needed and you'd be looking for the slightest decrease in visual presence of bubbles.



All: I am in the process of installing a secondary fuel system to supply VO in two W210s. One is a 606.962 and the other is the 606.912. Water Injection and EGR elimination are also being included. I am removing all glow plugs and reaming the prechambers. I have a full set of Viton O-rings to replace every seal in the stock fuel system. The bypass hoses have been replaced with Flouroelastomer that holds up well to VO/Bio. Expect updates soon.

Please note: Anyone that has not yet replaced the delivery valve seals should prepare for it. Every 603-606 I have worked with has needed delivery valve seals in a short time.
You need:
Remove intake (new gasket)
Delivery valve o-rings (viton are best)
Delivery valve copper sealing washers
Delivery valve splined socket.
Consider servicing the Glow plugs at the same time.
Consider replacing all fuel system o-rings.

Another note: Replumbing of the 606 IP will be necessary to run a proper 2 tank system.

We are putting together a website that will provide everything we have learned so far.


________________________________________________________
Has anyone converted a W210 Mercedes to use SVO?
http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/ev...=857104535#857104535
 
Location: Arlington, Va.  | Registered: October 14, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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So just to double check -- OK to run the engine in order to test fuel lines WHILE the manifold is pulled?

Thanks all,

Chuck
 
Registered: December 30, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I'd have to run the engine with the manifold pulled, right?

Why would you want to do that?



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Ummm, because at least with my hands, I can't clearly see and identify testing under-vaccuum fuel fittings (for leaks) without having the manifold out of the way. True?
 
Registered: December 30, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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Access is up to you to decide.



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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You may find that it wont be happy running with an open head.

Why not just check every connection and make sure all are fine. Take each one apart.


________________________________________________________
Has anyone converted a W210 Mercedes to use SVO?
http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/ev...=857104535#857104535
 
Location: Arlington, Va.  | Registered: October 14, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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try spraying WD40 on each fitting starting


Hi Renntag, I was thinking of trying John's suggestion. I know it is possible to "get" to those fittings somewhat by removing the washer reservoir. Super awkward and cramped for me, Mr. Fumble Fingers. The only thing with the fittings is that pulling and reinserting them can also introduce new issues, so I was thinking that this test seems like a good approach.
 
Registered: December 30, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Then go for it, But understand that given the sensors in the air tract, the computer is not going to like running without a manifold. also note that your test may be flawed trying to spray fittings next to where air is being sucked into the head.

I can appreciate not wanting to mess with the fittings, but that might be your best bet.

What I would really suggest is to re-order the lines. (change the way the IP is plumbed so it is no longer under vacuum, but rather putting many of the fittings under pressure).


________________________________________________________
Has anyone converted a W210 Mercedes to use SVO?
http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/ev...=857104535#857104535
 
Location: Arlington, Va.  | Registered: October 14, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hey guys,

I just wanted to give you all an update on what is going on with my 98 e300d om606.962.

Prior to even thinking about putting wvo in my car, I have had odd noises coming from the engine and under the hood. So, before I started using the wvo on a regular basis, I wanted to get those problems tracked down and taken care of. Also.. air bubbles in my lines.

On my own, I fixed the air bubbles in the fuel lines after finding 3 bad(flattened) o-rings. Replaced those with Viton o-rings. Even the one around the pre-filter was bad. Replaced a leaky main coolant hose.

Getting the odd noises taken care of, cost me over $900. The majority of it was from bad bushings on the belt tensioner level. (The part that the small shock absorber and the spring are attached to. Also, the mechanic determined the other noise was being caused by the alternator. The alternator alone was over $500. Being they already had the car and determined the issue, I had them go ahead with the repair. I called the dealer to get a Alternator price from them, it was $563.
Now, the engine finally sounds great!

So, on the WVO part.
I am a home beer brewer, but havnt brewed in over a year. So, I came up with an idea to use my 2 brew buckets for wvo filtering. Also, I am using the grain bag for the 2nd filter. Also 3rd filter is a PVC canister containing various filter materials. The canister is between the primary and the secondary bucket. The secondary bucket contains the final filtered wvo oil. I fill the empty cube's with that oil and let it set for 2 weeks before I use it.

Basically, I half fill a cube with wvo, then highway diesel, a little white kero(Coleman lantern fluid) and a little regular gasoline.

I have ran about 60 gallons of this mix, poured straight in the tank,so far and the car seems to love it. I don't see any exhaust until I floor it.

I have not replaced the tank strainer/filter yet, but I did purchase the part.

These engines, being that the fuel has to go through 3 filters before getting to the injection pump, should handle wvo pretty good, I would think.
 
Location: Chesterfield,Va | Registered: March 10, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Note to all that in the summer months, blending can be done without all the other fluids. Just a percentage of clean VO and either diesel, Kerosene, or home heating oil. If ambient temp is above 50-60 *F, a blend of 50% is fine.

Note also that when adding VO or Biodiesel to a system that has only seen petro diesel will cause grime to be loosened and moved forward. I highly recommend Putting a clear pre-filter sourced from a W123/124/126 and run the fuel line up by the ABS pump to provide access for monitoring and interim service.

I am currently undergoing installation of a secondary heated fuel system in a 97 E300D. I will have pics and info to share as we compile everything. So far all is going well.


________________________________________________________
Has anyone converted a W210 Mercedes to use SVO?
http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/ev...=857104535#857104535
 
Location: Arlington, Va.  | Registered: October 14, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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half fill a cube with wvo, then highway diesel, a little white kero(Coleman lantern fluid) and a little regular gasoline.

The "Coleman lantern fluid" is naphtha. For all practical purposes it's the same as gasoline. I add up to 10% petrol [w/o alcohol] when the temperatures are below 40°F.

It would be a good idea to test the fuel mix to be sure it has no water.
http://www.burnveg.com/forum/about72.html



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Colin,

I would definitely like to see that installation. So, you decided to hold on to that car and do the conversion.

I have found a few stories online about the VW engines seem to be more inclined to develop coking issues on the rings. The think it is due to direct injection.
 
Location: Chesterfield,Va | Registered: March 10, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Where can I buy "Naphtha"? Ace Hardware?
Good idea on the water test. Instead of using a frying pan. I could heat up the bottom of a metal coffee can with a torch. Test the temp with my non contact thermo and pour a about a tablespoon on for a test. I think my wife would give me a hard time for using her frying pan. hehe.

When I pour the mix in my tank, I keep a close eye on the oil. There's always a very small bit at the end. A gray/brownish fluid in the bottom. When I see that, I stop.
 
Location: Chesterfield,Va | Registered: March 10, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Where can I buy "Naphtha"?
Anyplace that sells camper stove and lantern fuel

AKA 'White Gas', Naptha, Coleman fuel

Simple water test
Get a big cooking spoon or ladle from the 2nd-hand store. Take a sample of the clean dry VO before it's mixed with anything, and heat the bottom of the spoon with a torch for a quick and easy rough test for bubbles of H2O.



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Update

Ok, my routine is to collect my oil over the weekend. I usually get around 8 gallons. Filter it through a 100 micron filter, then heat the oil to above 220 to purge the water. I do this until the oil stops popping, then let it cool down. Then pour it through a 1 micron filter, into my 35 gallon container. Fill a cube half full of oil then the rest diesel. Add some gasoline or Nafta or Acetone. Let it rest for a day or two, then pour it into the tank.

I have been doing this since March of this year and the engine is still purring like a kitten. The only negative is that I have to change the fuel filter more often than I used to. You can tell when it is needing changing, by a slight loss of power and more exhaust smoke when you accelerate.


Also. I have purchased a 1994 GMC 2500 P/U truck with a blown engine (6.5 diesel) I have a new engine out of a military HummV with low miles that we are in the process of swapping. Hopefully will be on the road soon and I will be slowly introducing WVO in to the fuel system.

This is my update, all is well with the W210 running blended WVO.
 
Location: Chesterfield,Va | Registered: March 10, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hi everyone,

I'm currently in the process of finishing the design of a system specifically tailored to the Mercedes E300 W210. This system is of very high quality, does not alter the OEM fuel routing and as a result, provide very reliable OEM diesel comparable WVO / SVO service. Please visit my website and send me a message to express your interest and for more details. I'm exited to offer this system and share the wealth of information I have gathered over the years of running WVO and designing systems and parts.

Jake

Attaboyenergy.com
 
Location: Pennsylvania  | Registered: December 13, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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I've rescued a '96 that was coked with poor biodiesel, left in the lines too long...etc. and wanted to add water injection to prevent a repeat of the problem. I have a nifty way to do that now. The windshield washer tank has a nipple at the bottom that is not connected to anything. I ran a vinyl line from this nipple to a simple plastic "L" inserted into a hole drilled in the rubber intake just downstream of the air filter box. The air accelerates just enough here to create a vacuum during high rpm operation, and draws a small stream of water into the manifold. The washer bottle seems custom designed for this and has a heater for winter and a low fluid warning. No possibility of siphoning, hydraulic lock, no moving parts. Adjust the line length to regulate the amount of fluid injected. Total cost: free. Pics on demand. Next steps: I might add a little lye to the water to degrade any carbon deposits behind the rings. Anyone tried this?
 
Location: puget sound | Registered: December 14, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Yes would love to see pic's. So the water is injected upstream of the air filter? And if so does it get wet?

I've always thought that blue methanol-based wiper fluid would be good for this. In fact I had a Miata once where I rigged up something similar, but your set up sounds elegant-in-simplicity.

Thanks,

Chuck
 
Registered: December 30, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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