I believe I said 'at least two years' but that doesn't matter.

The real point is that the acid phase converts FFAs using sulfuric acid as a catalyst. Following base phase therefore cannot make soaps since there are no FFAs available to do so. As a bonus, you get additional fuel. Any excess alcohol can be recovered from the glycerine, so I don't mind over dosing the mix with it.

By the way, should anyone ask again, you must NEVER use nitric acid thinking to save time money or for any other reason. The results would impress combat engineers!

BDycus,

in general I agree..
at first is seems you're saying my method is no different that alex's method..this is just not the case.

some differences.
8% methanol vs mine of 12%
1ml h2SO4-always..mine changedsdepending titration. alex doesn't titrate!
upper working limits..alex- not known..mine I have help people with over 80KOH. I've personally done 55KOH..sure these required 2 acid stages..but my method predicted the results for both stages..can alex's do that?

i think he's will fail for titrations over 8KOH. mine..sorry 7 is the lowest i will normally run acid/base processing..time in processing trade off. my floor would be 3..this would mean adding no acid.

quote:

Following base phase therefore cannot make soaps since there are no FFAs available to do so

you don't need FFA's to make soap you need oil. its oil plus water plus a caustic makes soap. these are all present in the base stage. in fact the acid stage adds water to the mix. does Alex's method mention draining? at what level?

I think when you compare the two you find my solution is more complete. not without holes and problems..but I don't claim its foolproof. its not.. but 4 failures out of about 150 batches is great average.

-dkenny

Although it doesn't matter much, it must be considered that when you titrate with 12% methanol in solution that you need to re-work your figures accounting for the new total volume.

I do 275 gal batches, so I figured the 35 gal of methanol I have been adding was significant enough to sway my titrations a bit.

For example.

Titration of 1.4 = ~1.1% of 963 kg.

Add 35 gal methanol, assuming homogenous, titration will now be ~0.9%.

Not saying dkenny's method is wrong, in fact is is pretty much the system I have been using for the last couple of years except I use NaOH and personally I have never found additional acid beyond 1.5ml/L to be very beneficial.

I have this "super catalyst calculator" that I made up in google docs that takes into account volume changes, acid neutralization, different catalysts, etc.

Check it out.

The section on "Add this much Sulfuric Acid" is currently entered by hand as I started fiddling with it when I learned of dkenny's formula.

Just remember the more acid you add the more you will have to neutralize, and neutralizing acid creates water and a salt.

BTW: Sodium methylate creates a different salt than sodium hydroxide. Sodium bi-sulfate vs sodium sulfate. The difference in salts seems to make seperating the glycerol take longer. Just my observation while using sodium methylate with acid process.

I don't promise all the numbers are correct, just something I was fiddling with. They seem right though.

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pr-tvSfIA0ahOw-jcytydSw

--
Jeff Brandt
The SunBreak BioStudio, LLC
http://www.sunbreakbiofuels.com
mailto:jeffb@sunbreakbiofuels.com

Yes, I was wondering if you could help me with the mathematical formulas for the acid / base stage, on how to determine the amount of sulfuric acid to add per liter of oil when titrating and processing with NaOH, if you don’t mind, spell it out for me!

titration minus 3 times .2 = ml of acid to add fr each liter of oil. Add acid to 60% of the amount of methanol you had planned on using. mix for up to 24 hours or until titration stops dropping. Check titration every 1/2 hour. Once you have your new titration, add your NAOH to the other 40 percent of the methanol and process as normal