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hi there i have been making biodiesel for around 4 years now,but on this one i am stumped.i have a 1000l conical tank which i make 500l of bio in a time.i use the foolproof method and have had great succes with it.however this batch will not react.there was no glycerin produced just a vat of sludge and jelly like stuff.i then thought it was water in the oil so i washed it out dryed the oil and started again.the first acid stage seemed to go ok,but i then added the methoxide and instantly got loads of white flakes appear on the top of oil and kept reactor going for at least 5 hours but still no glycerine separation just gunk.do i put it down to bad oil,but am gettin from same place and it looked fine,any help will be greatly appreciated as is a lot of oil to lose
 
Registered: March 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hello, I am new to the biodiesel hobby and have no experience but have been reading for a while now. In the call for BD producers using acid they explain that the white flakey stuff you are seeing may be cleaners used in the cooking oil. This will neutralize your acid and render it ineffective. It doesn't take much base to neutralize the acid as found in using a single processor for Acid Esterification. The remaining caustics in the lines hinder or render the acid added useless. Now this is off the top of my head which has absorbed way to many facts about bio not to find the discussion for your self.
 
Location: Chicopee, MA | Registered: February 28, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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It still sounds like water is the culprit. If water is present when you add the methoxide you'll convert the oil to soap.
I've had similiar reactions where the whole batch would convert to jello. That's before I paid attention to water. I do a hot plate test(HPT) to see if the wvo bubbles when its poured into a hot pan . Any bubbling shows the presence of water.
 
Location: western new york | Registered: November 19, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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thanx guys.the oil has had no chemicals added,and i am sure the first reaction was due to water but when reprocessed the oil was hot plate tested.literally as soon as i added the methoxide lots of white chunks/flakes appeared on the surface
 
Registered: March 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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From this description it seems like you tried to do 2 base reactions on this. When the first didn't work you tried a second correct?

I'm guessing that you had a lot of water present in the first one that made a lot of soap. With the second one it sounds like you didn't remove that soap or account for any of the first reaction by lowering the catalyst level and have made glop.

What QC tests have you performed on any of the oil/glop you now have?
 
Registered: February 25, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
i use the foolproof method and have had great succes with it

care to share, you are the only one that I am aware of other than alex keck who has had any sucess with this method! The fool proof method from jtf was tested and retested on this forum about 6 years ago no one could get it to work as written. If you are following the fpm then the acid part will work, but then the base process as discribed does not call for enough caustic for base processing to work. Tom


" I don't know what I don't know until I know"
1994 GMC 6.5 Tubo 2005 Dodge ram 3500, 3 VW's 2000, 2002, 2005.
 
Location: Manitoba Canada | Registered: March 24, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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Are you using lye or KOH for the catalyst? Koh is more forgiving from my experience ,but I still dewater.
I can't see how you do a hot plate test to determine water content after the first reaction. Methanol is going to mess it up.
What was the initial titration?
 
Location: western new york | Registered: November 19, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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