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Soap test and wood shavings
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I've been soap testing my fuel for the first time and using the hardwood shavings for the first time.

Everything was going great, my results were;
360ppm -raw, demethed
283ppm -settled one week
192ppm -one pass thru wood shavings
60.8ppm -2 hours circulation in wood shavings

Tonight, I went out and circulated for one hour to get a sample and have tests done at work,
I did a soap titration and got 364.8ppm.

I dont understand this.
I either tested incorrectly, but Ive done the procedure every time, or I contaminated something somewhere.

To note, the fuel was sitting static in the shavings since the last run last weekend.

Any ideas? The shake up test tonight was very good, crystal clear water phase.


1996 K2500 4x4 6.5TD
 
Location: Southern Indiana USA | Registered: June 20, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Brian
-something isn't adding up here! with that much soap in the sample, there wouldn't be a clear phase after the shakem up test. I think you need to redo the soap test. Tom


" I don't know what I don't know until I know"
1994 GMC 6.5 Tubo 2005 Dodge ram 3500, 3 VW's 2000, 2002, 2005.
 
Location: Manitoba Canada | Registered: March 24, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Ok, but I'm almost out of bromo blue, they only give you like 15ml.
I ordered 120ml more last night, along with extra pipettes and a 2nd pump.

Do my first numbers look average? I was amazed.
This fuel is so clear and bright with so little effort.


1996 K2500 4x4 6.5TD
 
Location: Southern Indiana USA | Registered: June 20, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Brian
-the number I question is the one from work and only because the shakem up test had good results. If you retest that batch and it is still high for soap, what does that say for the long used and suposably proven shakem up test? Eek Tom


" I don't know what I don't know until I know"
1994 GMC 6.5 Tubo 2005 Dodge ram 3500, 3 VW's 2000, 2002, 2005.
 
Location: Manitoba Canada | Registered: March 24, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hmm.
We'll see tomorrow.
We have a new spectrograph machine from LT Ind., the QTA is gone.

One thing I did change since the first tests was add some of our 99% IPA to Norman's 100%.
Ours is not labled 'Ph neutral' as his is.
I hadnt considered this when refilling the IPA.

Brian


1996 K2500 4x4 6.5TD
 
Location: Southern Indiana USA | Registered: June 20, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I did another test this morning, Same results; ~365ppm. It's like I never did anything.
I messed up somewhere. I shoulda stopped the wood treatment when I hit 60ppm.

Unless I screwed up the test supplies, but I dont see how.
So im wondering if sitting in the wood shavings for a couple days, the wood released soap back into the fuel?
Shoot, IDK, 'just grasping at straws, here.

The shake up test is on my desk, I shook it again before bed and the water is clear, but there is a pencil point line between the water and fuel. It sorta resembles the top meniscus- very fine.

I still believe in the shavings process and will continue. I just need to get better at testing and knowing when to stop.

I'm going to pH meter the IPA at work today.


1996 K2500 4x4 6.5TD
 
Location: Southern Indiana USA | Registered: June 20, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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quote:
Originally posted by Weldshop:
One thing I did change since the first tests was add some of our 99% IPA to Norman's 100%.
Ours is not labled 'Ph neutral' as his is.
I hadnt considered this when refilling the IPA.Brian


Mine is no longer to be considered "PH Neutral" since I had a customer complain about it 9 months after purchase and demand his money back. Make that to read former customer. He did tell me he stored it in his open air workshop in Tucson, which was shaded most of the morning. Cripes.

The 99% ISO should make no difference in the results. Truth be known after opening and closing a couple times mine would probably be 99% also. Just stay away from the 70% stuff at Walgreens.

Norman
 
Location: Lincoln, NE | Registered: April 10, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Thank you, Norman,
Good to know.
The mixed IPA's pH @ 8.5. Not too bad. And I keep it sealed.

So...
I still have 365 soap after having it test at 60. Confused

I tested the fuel today and it was pretty good. One of my best batches yet.
FG, .08
TG, .09
Acid, .24
Cloud, -4.5C
MeOH, .12
We dont have a model for moisture yet. FG and MeOH are still being worked on.
The rest is pretty reliable, I'm told.

Before having the test kit, with these numbers and the shake up test, I'd be pretty content.
Now I need to see 60ppm again.

The shavings are 100 miles from my home, I'll get a pallet of them and keep trying.
Maybe I cant keep the fuel sitting in them.

I guess no-one else has had this problem with their wood shavings process?


1996 K2500 4x4 6.5TD
 
Location: Southern Indiana USA | Registered: June 20, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Brian,

I have no idea why your soap ppm went up after sitting in the shavings. You might want to take a sample and water wash it and dry it and test again alongside a sample that was only filtered through the shavings. That might tell you if your testing procedure is the problem.
 
Location: Chambodia | Registered: December 31, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Yes,
I'm waiting on another delivery from NebraskaBP, and will do.
What a bubble burster, I mean, I was right there! but I aint giving up.

I'm sure I do the same steps each time, I lay out Normans instructions as I do it. I have it memorized. It's pretty simple, really. One paragraph.

Twenty-sum-odd gallons shouldnt defunk the shavings, they're the same ones fabricator runs 3 tons thru.

Next time I see 60ppm or better, I'm stopping.


1996 K2500 4x4 6.5TD
 
Location: Southern Indiana USA | Registered: June 20, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Right off the top of my head I'm not sure what could cause that, the only thing I can think of is possibly you still have enough methanol to cause the soap to go back into suspension if left in contact with the shavings, I would circulate again for an hour or so and see what happens.
 
Location: West Michigan | Registered: April 26, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Beats me, I did a water wash and it was still high.
I'll stir up the shavings and run it some more today.

Thanks


1996 K2500 4x4 6.5TD
 
Location: Southern Indiana USA | Registered: June 20, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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