I am currently not using the GL1 to drive off the methanol becauase I don't have a venturi. I have a 110 gallon settle barrel, two 55 gallon drums welded together with a cone bottom. I run two 40 gallon batches to it and use it to drain off the glycerin. I poked a hole in the top and ran a metal line down close to the bottom above the line where any glycerin would collect. I ran the bubble for 48 hours the last time before I ran the BD through my wood chips. I got a great result on lowering the soap content. If I don't get better results then I am still happy. I can still smell the methanol in the wood chips though.

This weekend my wife went to her brother's house and I was in bio diesel tinkering heaven for 4 days. So of course I had been wanting to revamp the Woodchipper and I did. That is when I could smell methanol. Knowing I was probably contaminated I went to my bud's house for a beer cure. Beer and crawdad's are scientifically proven to reverse the effects of methanol poisoning .

LOL now the funning is over and I really have a serious question. How long would the bubbler take to drive off the methanol? I am thinking if I send it to the Woodchipper completely methanol free I can lower the water from 20 gallons to 10 gallons. Any thoughts are welcome.

Wal,

Check out the thread on bubble washing BD. Captain Caveman claims it takes only 72 hours at 95 degrees Fahrenheit. I bubble usually for two days and then allow to settle for a few more before I run through the chips. I used to let it settle for 3 weeks. Once I get a few batches ahead, I will go back to 3 weeks settling time.

I like the idea of keeping the soap instead of washing it out. It contains a good bit of BD already and you can convert the soap to FFA & then methyl esters with an acid stage.

I am experimenting now with cracking the glycerin byproduct into more purified glycerin, salt brine & FFA. Again the FFA will be useful for an acid stage conversion. The glycerin can be accumulated and used for soap or cracked further. I guess the salt brine could be used in the winter to melt snow/ice. We don't get much here, so I will probably burn it.

I need to get me a see through conical poly drum for this to all come together.

Well good. It has been bubbling since Sunday so I will turn it off when I get home. I am way ahead on fuel right now so I will let it just sit until Saturday. I will run it through the Woodchipper 2. I suspect it being methanol free, the soaps should hang up in the wood chips a lot better. We shall see. I will tkaes some photos of the new system if it works. I stacked two 55 gallon drums on top of each other and welded a shelf in the top of the bottom barrel. That shelf holds up a 35 gallon poly drum that the bottom and the top cut out of it. The bottom of the poly drum has a screen held inplace with expanded metal. THe point is to spray the wood hcips with the BD but if the pump over takes the gravity pulling the bd through the screen and it runs over the top of the poly drum then it just runs into the bottom of the 55 gallon drum on the outside of the poly drum. In other words in the single 55 gallon drum the pump ran too fast for the bd to go through the wood chips and could potentially over fill out of the top. Now if it goes over it won't spill out of the 55 gallon drum, it will just collect in the bottom. The other plus is I can run enough fuel at one time. So when it is done I can fill up both wash barrels and wash all 80 gallons at once.

OR... Hook up a small pump from the bottom barrel and feed it back up to top barrel and circulate for 10 hours or so. To me, 'water, wash and fuel should not be used in the same sentence! I'm closing in on 500 liters now with no water coming anywhere near my fuel.

The barrel is set up where it continuously takes from the bottom to the top in circulation. When I am ready I can pump it to the wash barrel to wash it with 20 gallons or less. I am not set up with the filter beads and don't intend too right now. I can handle 20 gallons of water for a perfect pass on my fuel.

Hi Wal,
I think you can weigh/heat/weigh for methanol.
I use the bottom half of an old coffee maker and a digital scale.

The methanol will flash a stream of tiny bubbles seemingly coming from nowhere on the bottom.
If you don't see bubbles by 150*F, there probly isn't any left.

Are you guys using heat or just bubbler and fan?
Sounds like you're using the drying/recirc drum. I have one of these with a heat spear type heater.
I'm too leery to leave it unattended for long. ie, during work or over night.

Still looking for the wood shavings source.

Brian

Weldshop,

Are there any Amish woodshops in your area? That might be a good source.

Eurocab

Good call. 'never thought of that.

I'm too sidetracked during the day to remember to pick up a phonebook or ask around....
It cant be impossible, especially 'round these parts.
Thanks.

Brian

All right fellas it aint working. 6 days with a bubbler and it is still laced with mathanol. Enough to knock a buzzard off a crap wagon. I am running it through the Woodchipper now and if you stand over the top of the barrel your getting a dose of methanol for sure. In the dark barn with a flashlight I could see the vapors rising from the top barrel. I am letting it run with the top open until the methanol is gone. I need to get my venturi up and going.

Sorry to hear that. 6 days is a long time to bubble. I am sure the wood chips will take care of it. I just like keeping as much soap as possible.

6 days is a long time. It is throwing a wrench into my fan right now. I like to brew all 300 gallons in a day and get it threw the rest of the processor over the course of a week. That leaves the rest of the month to do something else. As it stands now that aint going to happen. I will get it figured out and keep rolling along soon enough. I believe my problem is the barrel is sealed with the exception of a 3/4 inch vent tube that goes to the outside of the barn. I figured the bubbler would be enought to push the methanol out of the vent but I guess not.

I think you have it figured out. If your drum is open top, the methanol has someplace to go. If not, it will probably just hang out with the BD. I use a fan to blow across the surface of my open top drum freeing the methanol up to hang out someplace else -- like in the atmosphere. You wouldn't believe the soap that dropped out of the last batch and I keep cutting back on the catalyst.

If you are trying to drive off methanol from 300 gallons, I would try to recover it for sure. That's a lot of methanol. I am still working on my recovery still.

If you bubble or spray bio to drive off methanol you will likely polymerize the whole batch, if you try it keep sniffing for old paint smell, several years ago I tried those methods, both are a good way to ruin perfectly good bio.

Fabricator, Quote [If you bubble or spray bio to drive off methanol you will likely polymerize the whole batch, if you try it keep sniffing for old paint smell, several years ago I tried those methods, both are a good way to ruin perfectly good bio.]
Hi fab polymerization and high tan is something i am concerned about at the moment, it is how i am trying to work out why so many of you over there water wash. I only dry wash by driving off methanol and settling, some of my bio gives tan readings of 0.8-1.3 due to this method of washing /drying.
Is it the combination of heat and bubble spray not just one or the other? would you bubble drying your water washed bio not do the same thing cause high tan/poly, or is it only possible with methanol present. I see a lot of you combine heat and air to dry why does this not give high tan, this is confusing regards andy

quote:

Originally posted by fabricator:
If you bubble or spray bio to drive off methanol you will likely polymerize the whole batch, if you try it keep sniffing for old paint smell, several years ago I tried those methods, both are a good way to ruin perfectly good bio.

How long does it take to polymerize it? What happens when it gets polymerized? Do you run it anyway?

quote:

Originally posted by gilfish:
Fabricator, Quote [If you bubble or spray bio to drive off methanol you will likely polymerize the whole batch, if you try it keep sniffing for old paint smell, several years ago I tried those methods, both are a good way to ruin perfectly good bio.]
Hi fab polymerization and high tan is something i am concerned about at the moment, it is how i am trying to work out why so many of you over there water wash. I only dry wash by driving off methanol and settling, some of my bio gives tan readings of 0.8-1.3 due to this method of washing /drying.
Is it the combination of heat and bubble spray not just one or the other? would you bubble drying your water washed bio not do the same thing cause high tan/poly, or is it only possible with methanol present. I see a lot of you combine heat and air to dry why does this not give high tan, this is confusing regards andy

When I used to water wash I would use heat and spray drying, but when you are doing that the bio is wet at the beginning, and usually only takes 4-5 hours, polymerization was never a problem then, but when I went to centrifuge washing before I had the vacuum demeth set up I tried to "drive off" methanol by spraying, when you use KOH it takes a long time 12-16 hours for a 250 gallon batch, I definately came close to destroying a few batches that way, I am not sure what "tan" is and how do you measure it? I just go by smell, once you have smelled polymerized bio you never forget it.

quote:

Originally posted by wal1809:

quote:

Originally posted by fabricator:
If you bubble or spray bio to drive off methanol you will likely polymerize the whole batch, if you try it keep sniffing for old paint smell, several years ago I tried those methods, both are a good way to ruin perfectly good bio.

How long does it take to polymerize it? What happens when it gets polymerized? Do you run it anyway?

Polymerization happens when bio is exposed to air to much, it is as I understand it an oxidation process, and no, I would not run much polymerized bio without diluting it a lot with good bio, polymerized bio can, if much of it gets into the crankcase, turn your engine oil into a semi solid mass and ruin your whole morning.