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winter biodiesel!!!!
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quote:
Originally posted by daradec:
is anyone in ireland or similar climate using b100 in the winter


Last winter was my first with biodiesel. For road use I used B90 + 10% derv. For home heating and everything else I used B90 + 10% Kero. This year I’m hoping to get my hands on some out of date or test failed Jet A1. Here it’s normally re taxed by revenue and sold to industry as special winterised Kero. Price works out as normal Kero from what I’m told.

Sean


Eagles may soar but hogs don't get sucked in to jet engines.
BMW 530D B100 VW POLO B100 Ford TW15 B100 Hitachi E60 B100 Ford FM274 B100
 
Location: Dingle, Co. Kerry | Registered: May 02, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Are you saying it's illegal to use kerosene/stove oil/jetA to dilute your biodiesel?



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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up here in cavan temp fell to -19C last winter and as i've just started making bio i think it'd be safer for me to go back to dino for the cold snap this winter, hate the thoughts of going back to back to being a slave to the man Mad
 
Location: meath/ cavan | Registered: April 17, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by john galt:
Are you saying it's illegal to use kerosene/stove oil/jetA to dilute your biodiesel?
They are actually talking about using different types of kerosene to suppress wax formation, not as a dilutant.
Also it is not Jet A it is Jet-A1
 
Location: Apeldoorn | Registered: August 01, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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The difference between jetA and jetA1 is insignificant for our purposes.

quote:
different types of kerosene to suppress wax formation
describe your belief of how this "suppression of wax formation" occurs.



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by john galt:
The difference between jetA and jetA1 is insignificant for our purposes.
Have you done comparison testing?
Even if you are correct that does not alter the fact that it is Jet-A1, not JetA.
quote:
describe your belief of how this "suppression of wax formation" occurs.
I have no belief of how this suppression of wax formation occurs just like I have no belief of how Tetraethyl lead increasing the octane of petrol occurs.
 
Location: Apeldoorn | Registered: August 01, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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OK, just clearing up the fact that you're relaying someone else's opinion that you might have overheard in a bar or read on some internet forum, with no actual experience of your own.
To avoid any misconceptions here is actual referenced information on jet fuels. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jet_fuel
quote:
The primary differences between Jet A and Jet A-1 are the higher freezing point of Jet A (−40 °C vs −47 °C for Jet A-1), and the mandatory requirement for the addition of an anti-static additive to Jet A-1.

http://www.online.petro-canada...heets/en_US/w213.pdf



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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JetA is available in the US and Canada, don't let it concern you, since it's not available in Australia.

quote:
I am not sure why

That's OK. Your attempts to start arguments add nothing to the discussion. We know who you are by your inimitable style. Another sock puppet to add to the ignore list.



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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this forum was started to seek out like minded biodiesel producers in a similar climate to ireland to talk about what they do to there winter fuel.it was not started to bicker.lets get one thing straight,biodiesel can form wax like crystals in the winter and block your fuel filter(i know this from FIRST HAND EXPERIENCE),would be great to here some more winter bio mixes
 
Registered: March 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by daradec:
this forum was started to seek out like minded biodiesel producers in a similar climate to ireland to talk about what they do to there winter fuel.it was not started to bicker.lets get one thing straight,biodiesel can form wax like crystals in the winter and block your fuel filter(i know this from FIRST HAND EXPERIENCE),would be great to here some more winter bio mixes


I agree. However it is worth taking into account John’s contribution. Our past few winters could be classified as cold. Then there is very cold and extremely cold and away beyond that you have the cold John is on about. In the 1980’s we used to do some hauling up in the Scandinavia countries. One time I had a lassie towing me with a chain after the trailer went through the ice. The chain snapped just like glass. That is the cold John is operating in. A hot air gun is no good to you there trying to free up fuel lines. We used have to use blow torches just to release a brake activator. At that time we used to use petrol as an additive but 100LL was the mix of choice as we could go richer with it as the led reduced the detonation issue. Our counterparts across the pond in Yellowknife then started experimenting with various Jet A & A1 along with petrol and 100LL. This then spread to northern Europe but with different mixes due to engine designs. In short US engines are big cubed (20L plus) very low revving where European are light pistoned high revving, high compression 11 to 16L engines. Nowadays a lot of synthetic stuff is thrown in but it can be pricey.
Enough of that. I’m preparing my 530D for this winter and hoping to keep going on B90. That worked fine last winter in the VW. However the 530D is common rail whose pump runs on much tighter tolerances so I’m planning on adding some heating system. I think this is where John Galt could come in handy. These guys like the Aussies tend to be very self sufficient. They have to be as nobody in motor land develops anything for them. They wouldn’t know where to start so these guys do it themselves. What we need are tips and tricks for home building heating systems for our winter like injector pipes etc. What they use for their summer should be good enough for us.
I know I can purchase heating coils for my injector pipes but there very pricey. I might buy one and reverse engineer (copy) the rest. Has anybody here done this already?

Sean


Eagles may soar but hogs don't get sucked in to jet engines.
BMW 530D B100 VW POLO B100 Ford TW15 B100 Hitachi E60 B100 Ford FM274 B100
 
Location: Dingle, Co. Kerry | Registered: May 02, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Almost all used cooking oil contains animal fats dissolved in the vegetable oil. Biodiesel made from used cooking oil usually contains animal fat biodiesel dissolved in it. Warm weather petro diesel has paraffin wax dissolved in it. As temperatures approach the freezing point of water, these biodiesel-fats and petro-waxes solidify and settle out of the fuel solution and clog intake screens, fuel lines and filters. Fuel additives can inhibit the solidification of these fats and waxes, but generally they are expensive and only reduce the solidification temperature by a few degrees. In mild climates this might be adequate. In climates where it stays below freezing 24/7, such additives are generally ineffective. In cold climates one can heat the fuel system and/or dilute the biodiesel with low viscosity fuels like petrol, kerosene, stove oil or jet fuel, and then cold filter the mix before it goes into the vehicle tank. If you live where helicopters operate, sometimes you can get 'stale dated' helicopter fuel that they can't use, often for free. The legal ramifications of using these solvents is a function of local jurisdictions and beyond the scope of this discussion.

Trolls and disruptive influences who only want to bicker and start arguments over inconsequential details are unavoidable on open public forums. They can be recognized by the absence of any useful information in their messages. This forum has an ignore function which can block their messages on your computer. Click on their user name, scroll down, and select 'add ____ to my ignore list'.



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by john galt:
Trolls and disruptive influences who only want to bicker and start arguments over inconsequential details...
Do you mean that any time someone corrects your mistakes you think they are trying to start an argument? I do not recall an argument.
 
Location: Apeldoorn | Registered: August 01, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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quote:
Originally posted by Ninja12R:
At that time we used to use petrol as an additive but 100LL was the mix of choice as we could go richer with it as the led reduced the detonation issue.
A detonation issue in a diesel?
quote:
Our counterparts across the pond in Yellowknife then started experimenting with various Jet A & A1 along with petrol and 100LL.
Jet-a and jet-a1 are kerosene. So is number 1 diesel. Diesels have been running on kerosene for years.
As far as using gas in the mix, The old Mercedes owners manual recommends mixing gasoline with diesel fuel in their idi engines for a winter fuel.
 
Location: New England | Registered: November 01, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Our winter diesel is basically kerosene with lubricity additives for motor fuel use. The same base stock is also used for jet fuel and stove oil. Jet fuel has different additives and stove oil is just kerosene, but at a significantly lower price than kerosene sold in 20 liter pails. I use stove oil, jetB, and petrol to dilute biodiesel for my winter fuel mix. Fortunately our regional government isn't anal about what we burn for fuel, so off-road fuel isn't dyed, and we don't have to be concerned about some officious idiot dipping our fuel tanks.



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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here in ireland if they dip your tank and find kerosene then you get a big fine,what is the max kerosene mix i can use in a peugeot 2.0hdi engine,could i use 100% kerosene with no probs.did a few tests with mixing kerosene into summer bio .b90 got me down to -2c and b80 down to -4c.so at the moment kerosene is pretty much the same as the addditive hiberna that i use.i think i will have to go down the cold filtering route you suggested john.do not really want to dilute more than b80 but might have to if we get another winter like last year lol.
 
Registered: March 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by daradec:
could i use 100% kerosene with no probs.
Some types of kerosene such asJet-A1 are made to a spec which does not include a test for lubricty. That could be a problem. However tests have shown that adding a few percent of biodiesel will take care of this if there is any doubt.
Do you really need a fuel that will remain liquid down to -47deg C in Ireland.
 
Location: Apeldoorn | Registered: August 01, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I think I'll be going 50/50 with pump diesel when it gets very cold, I couldn't be a**ed running the gauntlet with customs, not worth it in my opinion. I'll be leaving a jar of bio on the windowsill and watching out for clouding etc,.
 
Location: Clare, Ireland | Registered: May 20, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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you could be right gerard b.it got to -17c here last year so around -20 to be sure not -47,i was saying could you use 100%kerosene in diesel car with no probs to the car.in other words what is max percentage of kerosene can you mix in with biodiesel,thanx all darren
 
Registered: March 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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.in other words what is max percentage of kerosene can you mix in with biodiesel

I wouldn't go any lower than cold filtered B5, since kerosene does not have sufficient lubricity and biodiesel is the best lubricity additive one can use.

Why will they give you fines for using kerosene as motor fuel? Is it dyed?



 
Location: coldest N.America | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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The kerosene sold here is has no lubricity additives and will almost certainly cause accelerated wear or even pump failure if used alone or in strong mixes. In any case it contains marker dyes so any mix stronger than 10% will be regarded by the revenue as illegal fuel. If the temp falls below -10C for any length of time you would be best to change over to dino diesel for a while.
 
Location: Lismore Ireland | Registered: November 25, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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