Here's the web site


Couldn't find any references in a search. Anyone know whats up? Snake Oil? Master Formula in a can? Inquiring minds want to know


edited by Girl Mark- I was trying to make this a sticky (I guess I dont' know how to). I didn't actually change anything he said.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: girl mark,

From the Website

"Our system "thins the oil" through our simple mixture of easy to find ingredients"

Thats the key line, isn't it....
Got me curious what they are marketing. Not $40 worth of curious, but would be interesting to know. Best guess would be gasoline thinning, as I know that would fit with the claim the Europeans have done it for years.

THe problem is that the Tooth Fairy has a copyright on the "secret" mixture. I'll bet Tilly's hidden fortune that whatever it may be, 1) it is NOT BIO and 2) will leave one sadly dissapointed.

C'Mon, if it were for real, Santa Claus would give it to you free!

Bwahahaha! Yeah right; this is just like Homer and Abe Simpson's Miracle Tonic or the Flaming Moe .
I was just about to post about this and saw this thread; well, if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is .

quote:

Originally posted by JOAT:
Here's the web site


Couldn't find any references in a search. Anyone know whats up? Snake Oil? Master Formula in a can? Inquiring minds want to know

On thier website they are bashing Biodiesel because of the use of methanol and exagerate the ill effects of improper handling of methanol
I had dieselsecrets send me a MSDS sheet on their secretive additive,

They are peddling a dimethylbenzene xylol cocktail!
Well, if I had to fall into a pool filled with one or the other, i would choose the methanol.

I would love to post the actual MSDS sheet, it is in MS word, but my free trial of MS office expired, (if anyone wants to send me a key-code, I won't tell) then I could post the sheet

Makwa:

Download "Open Office" --it can read and write MS Word files.

And it is FREE!

quote:

Originally posted by Big Makwa:

They are peddling a dimethylbenzene xylol cocktail!

Doesn't sound good. Any idea what the results are emissions-wise? And are their dangers to handling this stuff or mixing it in an open tank?

Jerry

quote:

Originally posted by JerryPT:
Doesn't sound good. Any idea what the results are emissions-wise? And are their dangers to handling this stuff or mixing it in an open tank?

Jerry

There are dangers with every chemical. One very dangerous substance is non-aqueous di-hydrogen oxide!

I bit! After 2 days and no responce or link being sent I sent them an e-mail demanding a responce.

They responded with this:
The order page CLEARLY says we will ship in 4-5 days.
The Home page also says that you will be emailed the
video at the time of shipment. You may contact Paypal
if you like, but I fail to see how we have failed when
we are doing PRECISELY what we claim. If you cannot
wait, let us know and we will give you a refund. We
thank you for your patience.
DSE Team

It pissed me off, I just responded with a request for my refund.

Square G

I was able to cut & paste off my old W95 SYS. here is the actual MSDS info I was sent.

DSE additive Material Safety Data Sheet
General
Synonyms: dimethylbenzene, xylol
Molecular formula: C6H4(CH3)2 This is a mixture of the three xylenes, m-xylene (CAS 108-38-3), o-xylene (CAS 95-47-6) and p-xylene (CAS 106-42-3), and often also contains ethyl bezene (CAS 100-41-4).
CAS No: 1330-20-7
EINECS No:
Physical data
Appearance: colourless liquid
Melting point: -48 C
Boiling point: 137 C
Vapour density: 3.7 (air = 1)
Vapour pressure: 5.1 mm Hg at 20 C
Density (g cm-3): 0.87
Flash point: 27 C (closed cup)
Explosion limits: 1.1 - 7%
Autoignition temperature:
Water solubility:
Stability
Stable. Highly flammable - incompatible with strong oxidizing agents.
Toxicology
Harmful if swallowed or inhaled. Eye, skin and respiratory irritant. May act as a narcotic. Typical TLV/TWA 100 ppm.
Toxicity data
(The meaning of any abbreviations which appear in this section is given here.)

ORL-RAT LD50 4300 mg kg-1
SCU-RAT LD50 1700 mg kg-1
Transport information
Personal protection
Safety glasses, good ventilation. Remove sources of ignition from the working area

General
Synonyms: albocarbon, mighty 150, mighty rd1, moth flakes, NCI-C52904, white tar, naphthalin, naphthene, camphor tar, tar camphor, moth balls
Molecular formula: C10H8
CAS No: 91-20-3
EC No: 202-049-5
Physical data
Appearance: white crystals
Melting point: 77 C
Boiling point: 218 C
Specific gravity: 1.14
Vapour pressure: 1 mm Hg at 20 C
Vapour density: 4.4 g/l
Flash point: 88 C
Explosion limits: 0.9 - 5.9%
Autoignition temperature:
Stability
Stable. Flammable - avoid sources of ignition. Incompatible with oxidising agents. Heat-sensitive. Sublimes slowly at room temperature.
Toxicology
May cause irritation. Toxic by inhalation or ingestion. TLV 10 ppm. Sensitizer. Possible carcinogen.
Toxicity data
(The meaning of any abbreviations which appear in this section is given here.)

ORL-CHD LDLO 100 mg kg-1
UNR-HMN LDLO 29 mg kg-1
ORL-MUS LD50 533 mg kg-1
IVN-MUS LD50 100 mg kg-1
ORL-RBT LD50 3000 mg kg-1
Irritation data
EYE-RBT 100 mg/mld
SKN-RBT 495 mg open mld
Risk phrases
(The meaning of any risk phrases which appear in this section is given here.)

R20 R21 R22 R36 R37 R38 R43 R45.
Personal protection
Safety glasses. Use efficient ventilation.

Xylenes (Xylol)

Health: 2
Flammability 3
Reactivity 0
Hazard Rating:
Least Slight Moderate High Extreme
0 1 2 3 4
NA = Not Applicable NE = Not Established

Section 10 Stability and Reactivity Information
Stability: Stable Conditions to Avoid: Avoid contact with heat, sparks, flames, or other sources of ignition.
Materials to Avoid:
Oxidizing materials
Hazardous Decomposition Products:
Oxides of carbon, acrid fumes
Hazardous Polymerization:Will Not Occur
Condition to Avoid:None known
Section 11 Additional Information
Effects of overexposure, Acute and Chronic: Irritation of eyes, nose and throat. Reversible eye damage, dermatitis, chemical pneumonia, central nrevous system depression. Conditions aggravated: Persons with pre-existing eye, skin or respiratory conditions may be more susceptible. Target organs: Liver and kidneys.


Methanol (Methyl Alcohol)

Health: 3
Flammability 3
Reactivity 0
Hazard Rating:
Least Slight Moderate High Extreme
0 1 2 3 4
NA = Not Applicable NE = Not Established

Stability: Stable Conditions to Avoid: Section 11
Materials to Avoid:
Section 11
Hazardous Decomposition Products:
Carbon dioxide, carbon monoxide
Hazardous Polymerization:Will Not Occur
Condition to Avoid:None known
Section 11 Additional Information
Conditions to avoid/Incompatibilities: Avoid heat sparks, and open flames. Incompatible with Acids and Oxidizers. INGESTION:may be poisonous or fatal or cause blindness if swallowed. Exposure may adversely affect people with chronic disease of the central nervous system, skin, gastrointestinal tract or eyes.


O-MY-GOD
That stuff is Soooooo much safer,, I cant believe I have been trying to do VooDoo and Black witchcraft with BioD when there is an alternative that will only rot my liver and kidnys, while leaving me with REVERSABLE eye dammage.

TTFN

Ive been a big supporter of diesel-related clean-air ideas for a long time. This product seems to be a way to actually make it reasonably easy to use an SVO product.

It seems like all arguments that im hearing against this product dont actually address the issue of the products effectiveness. In a way, we are starting to sound like FOX news, by not addressing the real question - only beating around the bush and colluding the issue with other topics. So,


HAS ANYBODY ORDERED IT, AND DOES IT WORK?

Ive done a little bit of research on the topics of xylene, dimethylbenzene and xylol. Correct me if im wrong, but all seem to be synonyms and describe the same chemical.

It seems that the only problem that I can find is that it can eat your rubber seals if they are not the Viton rubber.... A problem that exists with pure biodiesel as is....

In GB Diesel (DERV) is $ 21 A gallon so some enterprising welsh men decided to use cooking oil from ASDA (Wallmart). To make it work they added the magic ingredient which is White Spirit.After one got a $900 fine for tax avoidance they set up shop as a biofuel agent and now sell it legally at 20% discount.

I have heard of the old Naptha (or Benzene maybe) & mothball trick used around WW2 times when gasoline was heavily rationed. But in a diesel running on straight veggy oil with these additives?

This kinda basically boils down to: (Screw the environment, I just want to drive for less money)

So, what do we think of Diesel-secret now?
And what does this volatile cocktail do to your engine?

Many napthas or aromatic solvents contain napthalene. Mothballs are almost 100% napthalene. In the oil field, guys will use free 'casing head' gasoline which is free to them but very low in octane. They would add mothballs which they called "pure octane."

But, diesel needs cetane which I understand to be the opposite of octane.

White spirits, as I understand, is what we in the US call mineral spirits. Some mechanics may call it Varsol, Exxon's version. These products are aliphatic solvents (like diesel) and will have little if any napthalene or any aromatic solvents.

The aromatics make for great solvency. But, they are more volatile and evaporate much quicker. They may have the same flashpoint but the evaporation of the aromatics is much faster.

I work with these chemicals for their cleaning power. Unfortunately I don't have a clue as to how they affect fuel values.

Todd T

I had some involvement with Biopower yonks ago. The Diesel Secrets lingo does smack of Biopower

At the beginning Biopower were using about 5% white spirit and 95% SVO and putting it through a mixing and settling process, which I don't think did very much and then use it almost like straight veg oil.
The white spirit (mainly used as paint brush cleaner) was there primarely because it has a lower flash point than SVO and allows start up in warm weather with no heating.
Many alternatives could be used including kerosene (No.1 fuel for home heating, among other things)

As biopower progressed they started experimenting with other solvents which would improve the ignition quality of the fuel (apologies if I have forgotten the fuel lingo to describe this properly)
They then started talking about secret formulas and selling the additives to trusted agents.

Perhaps now they are branching into the US or maybe someone else has beaten them to it.

I don't know what Diesel Secrets are doing about the viscosity of their fuel, but no matter how hard I tried I could not get the viscosity anywhere near petro or bio diesel using the Biopower process.

I would say this though, if they are burning 95% SVO and using a process which is much safer than the biodiesel process and the fuel is acceptable to the people using it, then why knock them.
It is still good for the environment, they are promoting biofuels and they are running a business to make a profit - what's the big deal - or am I missing something?

GM: I think I recall that one synonym for white spirit is "mineral turpentine". It's an aliphatic naphta, very low on aromatics, and is useable as fuel right off the shelf.
I use it to prime my filters when I can't find anything else...

Paul

This is a response to Cade, and others.

As I see it, here is the crux of the problem with the Diesel Secret approach:

Most diesel engines want a low viscosity fuel that is a lot like petro diesel. That's what they were designed for after all so that's not a big shocker. Veggie oil has very high viscosity by comparison. Biodiesel people do their whole chemistry magic (transesterification) for that exact reason. It dramatically lowers the viscosity of the veggie oil.

Of course, there are other ways like "thinning" the wvo with other solvents. This WILL reduce viscosity somewhat, but definitely not as much as transesterification (making biodiesel).

Now comes the fussy part (the devil is often in the details):

1. Some diesel fuel injection pumps and related fuel systems are pretty tolerant of high viscosity fuel. The old mechanically injected, indirect injection mercedes immediately spring to mind. They'll burn about anything oily that you can push through the fuel line (a slight exageration, but only slight...) Other systems like my VW PD TDI (Volkswagen Pumpe Duese Turbo DIRECT Injection) are not very tolerant of high visc. fuel. So this thinned wvo might work well in some vehicles and not so well in others.

2. Cold weather performance. Can we use this product in the winter??? Biodiesel is worse than petrodiesel and thinned veggie oil is worse than biodiesel for viscosity in cold weather. How cold does your winter get? Do you have a fuel line heater? How about a tank heater? Would getting stranded in the winter be a big deal? The SVO (straight unthinned) veggie oil folks have developed some fairly successful strategies to deal with these exact problems. If you need the same solution/fix to run the thinned stuff in the winter, maybe you can just run WVO.

3. What's special about this solvent? Is there any evidence to suggest that it works better or more reliably or less expensively than kersosene?

It would be illuminating to see what their response is to winter performance.

Finest regards,

troy