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Sort of a Blog by tim c cook describing blend results in a 92 B350 dodge cummins
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This picture shows the water filter lifted out of the box.

Image4_-_water_filter_lifted_out_of_box.jpg (26 Kb, 21 downloads)
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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This shows the box with it's clamp-on cover installed. There is a notch cut in the top front edge of the box for the fuel hoses to pass through so the front latch can not be clamped down.

Image5_-_Box_with_cover_installed.jpg (23 Kb, 8 downloads)
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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This picture shows the heated and insulated fuel and return hoses passing through a hole in the bed of the truck. The fuel hoses are full length taped beside 5/8 inch heater hose using plastic electrical tape and then covered with foam insulation used for home water piping, the insulation was also full length wrapped with plastic electrical tape.

The supply hose is a 3/8 inch diameter yellow duel-layer plastic air hose, the return hose is an orange 1/4 inch duel-layer plastic air hose. These hoses had pressure, temp, and chemistry specs that worked for petrolium products and hot veg, they work but over time they have stiffened up a bit more than I like. If I had to do it again I think I would use Modern two-layer rubber fuel hose, it also stiffens up a bit with time but not as much.

Image1_-_Insulated_hoses_through_bed.jpg (26 Kb, 8 downloads)
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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This picture shows the insulated hoses tucked up between the cab floor and cross members below the floor.

Image2_-_hoses_tucked_up_under_cab_floor.jpg (21 Kb, 13 downloads)
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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This picture shows the 5/8 inch heater hoses running to ball valves that connect to the cab heater water pipes from the engine. The valves allow the water to be turned off if a problem occurs.

Image1_-_hot_water_hoses_under_hood_3.JPG (25 Kb, 13 downloads)
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Tim,

I am working on a conversion on a 91 Dodge and am wondering about how you plumbed the fuel system.

I am considering using Sunwizard's plumbing scheme shown here: http://www.burnveg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=28

How did you plumb your system, and how did you deal with the steel stock fuel lines into and out of the fuel filter and into the ip? What about fuel return lines?

Any thoughts would be appreciated.


98 Jetta TDI with aluminim tank HotFox fuel pickup, HOH, FPHE, Coolant Heated VW Oil Cooler Filter,VegTherm, Injector Line Heaters, 6 port Pollak, and 3 port Pollak for Backflushing veg. filter
100,000 grease miles
B100 - B20 Main Tank Fuel depending on outdoor temps. SOLD

81 Benz 240D 3 Gallon purge fuel tank, Heated Pickup Stock Tank, 12V pump, HOH, Coolant Heated Filter, 16 Plate FPHE, Injector Line Heaters, 2 Greasecar Valves, Looped on Veg., Return to tank diesel.and Injector overflow return to veg. tank

91 Dodge Cummins

2010 VW TDI Sportwagon
 
Location: Vergennes, VT USA | Registered: May 16, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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The fuel plumbing keeps changing over time, still don't have the final version installed. I now run two seperate electric Mallory gearotor fuel pumps, one for the diesel/cold blend in the original truck tank, the other for the heated veg. The output from these pumps are connected to manual on/off ball valves under the hood, I turn on which ever fuel valve and pump I want to run on. The return also uses a pair of ball valves to select which tank the fuel returns to. I have totally bypassed the stock lift pump and fuel filter, the stock engine mounted fuel filter costs at least $10.00 each and is a bugger to change so I DO NOT miss using it. I now use a whole house water filter in the heated box back by the veg tank as my veg filter, and a cheap metal F15 Fram throw away filter in line with the outlet of the diesel fuel pump. I also have a second F15 Fram filter just before the input of the IP, I am building a slip-over electrically heater for this filter.

The stock diaphragm lift pump worked fine even for cold blends and would allow it's output to be dead headed without any problem but I did have a problem ocassionally with the in/out internal check valves ocasionally not fully closing on cold blends. The electric pumps are just far more conveniant since they can be controlled from switches inside the cab. I will shortly be removing the fuel supply set of ball valves and replacing them with in-line hydraulic check valves, one in line with each electric pump, the outputs of the check valves will be "T"d together and run to the input of the IP. I will also be installing one of the old style Pollack solenoid type fuel selector valve for the return fuel switching. I also intend to install a fin-n-tube type heat exchanger, this is actually a stock Dodge Cummins automatic transmission cooler being used as a heater (the one mounted down low on the engine on the passinger side, not the one up in front of the radiator). The veg pump will push veg through this and the check valves will be mounted on the outlet fitting of the heavy steel heat exchanger body to insure a solid mounting. The outlet from the check valves will use 3/8 rubber fuel hose to first run the fuel through a throw away fuel filter before going to the IP input. Once these changes are made I won't have to open the hood to select fuels, just flip switches inside the cab.

I am still figuring out just how to mount all this, looks like the heat exchanger, the diesel electric fuel pump and it's filter, and the fuel return selector valve will be mounter on a plate mounted on the rear of the drivers side inner fender just in front of the fire wall, this allows the best routing for both the fuel and hot water hoses.

Fuel inlet to Bosh VE injection pump - Back when I was running single tank cold blends I was having fuel starvation problems on cold days due to the tiny 1/8 inch ID steel line that ran from the fuel filter outlet on the side of the head up to the IP. To eliminate this restriction I replaced the banjo fittings with custom made 11/32 I.D. hose barb fittings. These ware machined from 12 MM X 1.5 MM bolts. I used a longer hex head bolt and ran the threads down further until the threads stopped 3/4 of an inch below the bolt head, I then turned almost all of the bolt head down to form about a 1/16 inch high end flange for the hose to catch on, I then ran a nut all the way down on the threads and brazed it to the bolt, this allowed a hex section for a deep socket to be used on, I then cut the remaining bolt threads off 5/8 of an inch below the bottom of the hex nut on the hose barb for the head and 1 inch below the nut for the one used as the input for the IP. I then through-bored the bolt to an opening of 11/32. Would have liked to gone to 3/8 but I was afraid the wall thickness would be a bit too thin.

There are 4 pictures of the hose barbs, both with and without hoses fitted, near the bottom of page 3 of this discussion.

I used one of these hose barbs as the fuel outlet in the side of the head and another one as the inlet to the IP. The threads in the IP are a bit oversized for some reason so they will leak even when tightened down. The original banjo fitting was the same way, the Cummins fix was to use a copper washer as a gasket between the IP casting and the bottom of the banjo fitting. Because the threads fit loose is why I made the threaded portion of this hose barb longer than the other, I also uses an aluminum washer as the gasket rather than the much harder copper washer. The threads in the IP inlet go a long way down inside the IP into the chamber containing the internal centrifugal fuel pump section, there is nothing else under the IP input opening so the longer threaded section of the hose barb fit fine but the threads were still loose enough to rattle around even when fully screwed in but not tightened. The aluminum gasket has not leaked over the last several years.

This picture shows the two pairs of ball valves located under the hood.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Tim c cook,

Imagetemp_fuel_valves_-_closer.JPG (13 Kb, 16 downloads)
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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This picture shows the Cummins tranny cooler after I removed all the stock mounting brackets, I will use threaded rod to make clamp straps to mount it to the mounting plate. The outer casing of this unit appears to be made from pipe so it is plenty solid to hold both the fuel check valves connected to a "T" screwed into the outlet opening. It will be mounted with both the openings pointing up to eliminate the possibility of trapping air inside the housing.

Imagefull_exchanger.JPG (21 Kb, 16 downloads)
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I may also add a 240 watt electric heater between the outlet of the check valves and the inlet of the IP if it takes too long to get the veg hot through the hot water heat exchanger on cold winter days. I don't think this will be a problem but if it is I already have tested the heater assembly. It is made up of a 12 inch length of 3/8 black pipe slipped down the center of a big 1 ohm ceramic resister covered with insulation. This wiill mount along the top of the valve covers. This picture shows the basic heater without the insulation.

Imagecomplete_less_insulation.JPG (11 Kb, 15 downloads)
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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This shows where it will mount on the top of the engine.

Imagewhere_heater_mounts.JPG (24 Kb, 12 downloads)
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Tim,

Thanks for the details. I like the idea of using the G15 fuel filter for the diesel filter and completely by passing the stock setup. It is a PITA. Do you know what the micron rating of those throw away filters is?

I need to look more closely at the fuel line plumbing out of the stock filter but it looks to me like there is a steel line from a banjo on the fuel filter directly to the ip. I will have to consider tapping the ip inlet, though I am not sure I can get to that before we do the conversion during a work shop next weekend. I was just planning to take the steel line off and cut it with a pipe cutter, then put 5/16 or 3/8 fuel line over the steel line stub.

When you tapped the ip how did you deal with the metal filings?


98 Jetta TDI with aluminim tank HotFox fuel pickup, HOH, FPHE, Coolant Heated VW Oil Cooler Filter,VegTherm, Injector Line Heaters, 6 port Pollak, and 3 port Pollak for Backflushing veg. filter
100,000 grease miles
B100 - B20 Main Tank Fuel depending on outdoor temps. SOLD

81 Benz 240D 3 Gallon purge fuel tank, Heated Pickup Stock Tank, 12V pump, HOH, Coolant Heated Filter, 16 Plate FPHE, Injector Line Heaters, 2 Greasecar Valves, Looped on Veg., Return to tank diesel.and Injector overflow return to veg. tank

91 Dodge Cummins

2010 VW TDI Sportwagon
 
Location: Vergennes, VT USA | Registered: May 16, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Output from stock fuel filter - I think the 91 Dodge is the same as my 92, if so the banjo fitting is not mounted to the filter directly but to the fuel outlet on the vertical side of the head. The in/out openings for the fuel filter are both located in the head. There is a round hockeypuck sized electric fuel heater mounted between the top of the filter and the underside of the overhang of the head but both the heater and the filter mount on a center hollow fitting that is screwed directly into the underside 0f the head. There is a steel line running up along the side of the engine block from the lift pump, this steel line then makes a couple sharp turns and ends up with a banjo fitting laying flat against the vertical side of the head about 2 inches below and behind the fuel outlet from the head, this sends fuel through a few inches of passages inside the head to heat it a bit and also allows the fuel heater and filter to be solidly mounted directly to the underside of the overhang of the head.

I.P. inlet - It is already threaded, The stock inlet fitting is some wierd special fitting that looks sort like a bigger than normal brake line fitting, the fuel tube goes straight into the top of the threaded opening of the IP through a nut that looks like it should turn around the tubing, something like is used on double flared brake tube - NOT. The space around this fitting is extremely close and I never did figure out a way to make up any sort of wrench that would allow me to get to it, don't know how the factory did it. I finally used vice grips and crunched the tube together just above the top of the nut to keep any chips from falling into the pump inlet and then used a big set of heavy wire cutters to nibble throuugh the tube (I had bought a spare used steel line off Ebay just in case), this allowed me to get a deep socket down over the tube and fitting and finally remove it. As soon as you crack it loose you will find the wiggle in the oversized IP input threads, unless my pump as the only one with this problem for some reason? All this is also described near the bottom of page 3 of this discussion.

If you can cut the tube somehow without making chips I guess you could slip a hose over it ok, a compression type tubing cutter should work if you have room to turn it around the tubing.

Info about stock hockeypuck fuel heater - This heater is supposed to be temperature controlled somehow but there is no thermostat anyplace, it just connects directly to the +12 ignition volts. The only way it MIGHT be temp controlled is if the resistive heater element is somehow self limiting with temp, this is possible as the newer GM glowplugs work that way. The internal heater element is the size of, and looks like, a dime. It is located in the center of the unit. The heater on my truck was burned out before I bought the truck as were the heater elements in both the $25.00 used ones I got off of Ebay, never fogured out how to make it work with some other heating element. this is another reason why I bypassed the whole filter/heater/ lift pump assembly. The heater is removable by unscrewing the center threaded fitting that the filter mounts on, I even removed the heater and made a shorter fitting so that the filter was touching the head directly but I still had fuel starvation in cold weather when burning cold blends, the filter hangs out away from the block and never does get warm enough to pass thick fuel in cold weather, yet another reason to bypass it.

Banjo fittings - Another reason I wanted to eliminate all the banjo fittings is that they are extremely restrictive to fuel flow, the bolt through the center has only 2 holes drilled through the sides of it and these are smaller than 1/8 inch.

F15 Fram filter - Don't know it's micron rating exactly but I had Napa auto parts check with there supplier several years ago about there filter that looks the same, probably is the same, they said it was a 30 micron filter. This is probably about right as most of these throw away filters I have checked into say they are 30 micron. I have had cold weather veg fuel restriction problems using the F15 filters in cold weather, my final filter in the fuel system is one of these mounted in the rubber fuel line running from my temp ball valves over to the inlet of the IP (you can see it in the "temp fuel valves" picture above), this filter hangs out directly in the blast of air from the fan. Wrapping insulation around it helps but only after everything is up to temp, may not be a problem now that I have a heated fuel system on the truck but it was a agrivation whwn burning cold blends in cool weather.

The plate that will be mounting the water hested heat exchanger/electric fuel pump/F15 diesel filter/and return solenoid valve will be an 1/8 in thick sheet of aluminum laying on 1/2 inch plywood for strength and insulation, this F15 filter will only see diesel during the winter, plus get heated a bit from the hot aluminum plate, so I don't expect to have any fuel plugging problems with it. It will also be up where I can easily get to it if it needs replacing.

I am slowly building an insulated electric heater that slips over this filter so it is not in the way when I need to change out the filter. The heater is made from an exhaust pipe reducer fitting that has eight 1/2 ohm 5 watt sand resisters J B Welded to it evenly spaced, these are wired in series to make 4 ohms, applying 12 volts to these will produce 36 watts of heat, not a lot but I hope enough to keep fuel flowing, I intend to get this installed before winter, I hope.

this picture shows the filter and the exhaust adapter.

Imageoriginal_adapter_with_lable_and_filter.JPG (22 Kb, 12 downloads)
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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This picture shows the exhaust pipe adapter trimmed for length and the resisters epoxied in place. The J B Weld is actual epoxy based (not polyester) and is speced to a bit over 500 deg f so it should work without getting soft.

Imageheater_-_trimmed_and_eight_half_ohm_resisters_J_B_Welded_in_place..jpg (25 Kb, 16 downloads)
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Tim,

It looks as if the 91 stock fuel systems is the same. Here is the ip.


98 Jetta TDI with aluminim tank HotFox fuel pickup, HOH, FPHE, Coolant Heated VW Oil Cooler Filter,VegTherm, Injector Line Heaters, 6 port Pollak, and 3 port Pollak for Backflushing veg. filter
100,000 grease miles
B100 - B20 Main Tank Fuel depending on outdoor temps. SOLD

81 Benz 240D 3 Gallon purge fuel tank, Heated Pickup Stock Tank, 12V pump, HOH, Coolant Heated Filter, 16 Plate FPHE, Injector Line Heaters, 2 Greasecar Valves, Looped on Veg., Return to tank diesel.and Injector overflow return to veg. tank

91 Dodge Cummins

2010 VW TDI Sportwagon


ImageDodge1a.jpg (21 Kb, 10 downloads) Dodge ip
 
Location: Vergennes, VT USA | Registered: May 16, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Here is a closeup of the ip inlet. That is a funky fitting.


98 Jetta TDI with aluminim tank HotFox fuel pickup, HOH, FPHE, Coolant Heated VW Oil Cooler Filter,VegTherm, Injector Line Heaters, 6 port Pollak, and 3 port Pollak for Backflushing veg. filter
100,000 grease miles
B100 - B20 Main Tank Fuel depending on outdoor temps. SOLD

81 Benz 240D 3 Gallon purge fuel tank, Heated Pickup Stock Tank, 12V pump, HOH, Coolant Heated Filter, 16 Plate FPHE, Injector Line Heaters, 2 Greasecar Valves, Looped on Veg., Return to tank diesel.and Injector overflow return to veg. tank

91 Dodge Cummins

2010 VW TDI Sportwagon


ImageDodge2a.jpg (21 Kb, 13 downloads)
 
Location: Vergennes, VT USA | Registered: May 16, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Here is what I believe to be the fuel return from ip into head. Where does it go from there? To filter?


98 Jetta TDI with aluminim tank HotFox fuel pickup, HOH, FPHE, Coolant Heated VW Oil Cooler Filter,VegTherm, Injector Line Heaters, 6 port Pollak, and 3 port Pollak for Backflushing veg. filter
100,000 grease miles
B100 - B20 Main Tank Fuel depending on outdoor temps. SOLD

81 Benz 240D 3 Gallon purge fuel tank, Heated Pickup Stock Tank, 12V pump, HOH, Coolant Heated Filter, 16 Plate FPHE, Injector Line Heaters, 2 Greasecar Valves, Looped on Veg., Return to tank diesel.and Injector overflow return to veg. tank

91 Dodge Cummins

2010 VW TDI Sportwagon


ImageDodge3a.jpg (21 Kb, 9 downloads)
 
Location: Vergennes, VT USA | Registered: May 16, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Here is a view of the stock filter. Yes it does look like those banjos are on the head.


98 Jetta TDI with aluminim tank HotFox fuel pickup, HOH, FPHE, Coolant Heated VW Oil Cooler Filter,VegTherm, Injector Line Heaters, 6 port Pollak, and 3 port Pollak for Backflushing veg. filter
100,000 grease miles
B100 - B20 Main Tank Fuel depending on outdoor temps. SOLD

81 Benz 240D 3 Gallon purge fuel tank, Heated Pickup Stock Tank, 12V pump, HOH, Coolant Heated Filter, 16 Plate FPHE, Injector Line Heaters, 2 Greasecar Valves, Looped on Veg., Return to tank diesel.and Injector overflow return to veg. tank

91 Dodge Cummins

2010 VW TDI Sportwagon


ImageDodge4a.jpg (19 Kb, 8 downloads)
 
Location: Vergennes, VT USA | Registered: May 16, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Here is where I am thinking at the moment for fuel plumbing. I am going to use three valves and go with SunWizard's fuel plumbing diagram shown above. The FPHE will be before the filter however. Otherwise, should be just about the same.

I already have the valves and would like to keep using the stock lift pump for now, so I will go that route instead of using two fuel pumps. I may go that route down the road, but I don't have the cash for good pumps at the moment.

I think I will go for replacing the fuel ip inlet funky fitting with a hose barb, though I am a bit unclear on how to do this. Can I use a standard hose barb? If I can scavenge a decent diesel filter by next weekend head I am going to completely bypass the stock filter, or I will use the stock filter but abandon the steel fuel line from the filter to the ip.

How should I deal with the fuel return? This seems like another reason to ditch the stock d2 filter as it seems that the fuel return is somehow connected to that. Is that correct? It seems that I can use the stock fitting and cut it and put fuel line on the stub and t that to the injector spillovers behind the engine and then either ruturn to tank or loop. The third valve will control return fuel flow.

Coolant will flow from the head to a T with heater core. Fron there it will go 5/8" to FPHE to 3/8 to filter wrap and then back to hotfox tank heater then return to T at the output from heater core.

Any suggestions appreciated.


98 Jetta TDI with aluminim tank HotFox fuel pickup, HOH, FPHE, Coolant Heated VW Oil Cooler Filter,VegTherm, Injector Line Heaters, 6 port Pollak, and 3 port Pollak for Backflushing veg. filter
100,000 grease miles
B100 - B20 Main Tank Fuel depending on outdoor temps. SOLD

81 Benz 240D 3 Gallon purge fuel tank, Heated Pickup Stock Tank, 12V pump, HOH, Coolant Heated Filter, 16 Plate FPHE, Injector Line Heaters, 2 Greasecar Valves, Looped on Veg., Return to tank diesel.and Injector overflow return to veg. tank

91 Dodge Cummins

2010 VW TDI Sportwagon
 
Location: Vergennes, VT USA | Registered: May 16, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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Fuel return line - The tube you show in the picture IS NOT the IP fuel return line, it is the intake manifold turbo boost pressure input line from the intake manifold to the fuel enrichment diaphragm section located under the cover on the top of the IP. Nothing needs to be done with that.

The fuel return line fitting from the Ip is located on the back side of the IP between it and the engine block, a steel tube runs back from the IP hard against the side of the engine block and then it "T"s together with the fuel injector return line near the back of the engine just behind, and in back of, the fuel filter. The return line does not connect to the fuel filter in any way, it just runs behind it. The "T" is just visable if you use a flash light and look along the drivers side back corner of the engine block just behind the stock fuel filter and up against the engine block. There is one of the weird plastic push-on fittings just below the return line "T". I don't remember if I replaced the plastic push-on fitting with a standard hose barb or just slipped the return hose over the tube, I think I just used the tube.

The plastic push-together inlet fitting on the lift pump can be replaced with a standard 1/4 inch pipe hose barb.

IP input fitting - The opening is threaded a very loose 12 MM diameter with 1.5 MM threads, if you can find a hose barb with those threads it will screw in loosley, it will need to have some sort of a sholder that the metal sealing washer can screw down against. I never found one of any type let alone one with a 3/8 passage through it so I ended up machining one up from a 12 MM X 1.5 MM bolt bought at a Menards home improvement store.
 
Location: fisher,illinois,usa | Registered: June 03, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Thanks Tim! I am doing the conversion this weekend so I will keep you posted here on the results.


98 Jetta TDI with aluminim tank HotFox fuel pickup, HOH, FPHE, Coolant Heated VW Oil Cooler Filter,VegTherm, Injector Line Heaters, 6 port Pollak, and 3 port Pollak for Backflushing veg. filter
100,000 grease miles
B100 - B20 Main Tank Fuel depending on outdoor temps. SOLD

81 Benz 240D 3 Gallon purge fuel tank, Heated Pickup Stock Tank, 12V pump, HOH, Coolant Heated Filter, 16 Plate FPHE, Injector Line Heaters, 2 Greasecar Valves, Looped on Veg., Return to tank diesel.and Injector overflow return to veg. tank

91 Dodge Cummins

2010 VW TDI Sportwagon
 
Location: Vergennes, VT USA | Registered: May 16, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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