He just did for 6 pages. Now your exact chart is more like a "Zone" chart. You are beating a dead horse and have just spent page after page being schooled. What you are arguing about is irrelevant to anything material relating to the combustion of vegetable oil in a compression ignition engine.

Viscosity is only one facet of the subject and important only to a point. The various studies of the combustion characteristics of vegetable oils reveal surprising things if one bothers to read them and this is where Forest is attempting to lead you now, just as I was on page 5 of this discussion.

The way your interpreted the data you used has been shown to be wrong, your chart was shown to be wrong, you have been unable to differentiate between F & C on multiple occasions. Your chart has now, painfully, been corrected so that it now matches with the chart Forest produced and made available publicly while at Frybrid in early 2006.

Perhaps it would be a good time to thank Forest for tutoring you and move on to the next subject and take advantage of the time he is willing to continue schooling you.

quote:

Two basic hypotheses of this whole argument seem to be:
1. If the viscosity only of two fluids is the same, identical spray patters will result when sprayed out a diesel injector, and atomisation of the fluids will be identical.

2. Identical atomization is optimal for (unstated, but pick one: power, emissions, engine life, other)

You are assuming that there are two differnt hypothesis in this discussion.
I do not believe there are.

I think that "jumping the gun" into that "argument" will not lead to as productive a discussion as completing this topic first will.

Please be a bit more patient or begin a separate discussion on that topic.

Moon makes a good point, as the topic here is:

quote:

New diesel/SVO viscosity/temp chart shows 230F+ is the optimum temp

The subject would seem now to about the "ideal-ness" of such a temperature as it relates to the actual use it is put, combusting in a diesel engine. The chart does not demonstrate how that is affected, so the points that Forest brings up should be the natural next step in exploring this subject. Optimum temp for what?

quote:

Originally posted by moon161:
Two basic hypotheses of this whole argument seem to be:
1. If the viscosity only of two fluids is the same, identical spray patters will result when sprayed out a diesel injector, and atomisation of the fluids will be identical.

2. Identical atomization is optimal for (unstated, but pick one: power, emissions, engine life, other)

1) Not really, if the two fluids are substantially similar, perhaps, but fluids behave in many strange and different ways.

2) Again not exactly true. Even if atomization is very similar the molecules themselves are still different and therefore burn differently, this is the baby step I have been trying to get Dana to take. The process of combustion is more complicated than it is being given credit for here and involves "Cracking", flame fronts, ignition delays, combustion length, etc. This is why there is little difference between VO heated to 180F and oil heated to 300F. The viscosity adjusted by heat will only make a notable difference in combustion to a point, after that point other factors come into play, these are factors out of our control with older injection systems but in our control with newer systems where injection timing and the injectors themselves can be controlled and optimized for vegetable oil once the engine has been switched to that fuel.

quote:

Moon makes a good point

Yes he does.

But please be patient enough to allow the discussion on this chart to be completed first.
I would rather not assume that Forest can not provide some example of ASTM diesel fuel that falls outseide the min/max parameters in the chart. I expect it will take him at least a few hours to access all of the data he has available on that. It took me at least 3 hours when I checked the data I have on this subject.

I think that the subject everyone appears eager to start now will be much clearer once this last possible error in the chart has been cleared.