Ya'll are to kind Thanks for the compliements. Well things are working pretty good with only couple things needing attention.

My galvanized tank is gettin axed there goes a dead president down the toilet , but I'll be fabin up a custom aluminum tank with all the veggi fixins here in the next week or so. I'm also not sure my recent addition of a check valve between the tank feed and the filter inlet is going to fly. I believe it requires to much psi to open and since both it and the filter are on the suction side, my A1000 pump is cavitating. I'll be back on the grease in a couple of weeks weather permiting. I've run out of grease and with no bed it has been difficult to collect.

350 long rod , welcome .

Is it safe to bag filter with more than gravity ( no pressurized filter vessel ) only ? Look at this - http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=88433&item=5574243618&rd=1

This device seems a fancy way of clamping a filter bag around PVC pipe .

quote:

Originally posted by rkpatt:
Is it safe to bag filter with more than gravity ( no pressurized filter vessel ) only ? Look at this - http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=88433&item=5574243618&rd=1

This device seems a fancy way of clamping a filter bag around PVC pipe .

Not in my experience.

OilMotor...

You have a source for those ultra cheap filters?

Also, I would say 95% of us are just hanging the bags. I've thought about making some kind of support for them out of mesh or have even looked into commercial baskets to support them, but what I have found is that they are damn expensive. Ditto for the filter housings that these fitlers are actually intended for. I did come across a type of filter bag on McMaster that is actually intended to hang freely (no URL handy). They are meant to be tied to the end of a pipe and I may just try these when I expirement with different filtering setups - after I get my stupid car fixed, that is.

-TonyO

I have seen Andrew's WVO filtration system, which uses a gear pump to push the heated oil thru the filter. The filter is supported in a pressure chamber, so it doesn't rupture from the pressure.
I do not know the max operating pressure of his system.

The main problem with pressure fintering using an "unsupported" bag filter is as the bag expands the "pores" in the material that is expanding get larger. This means that the material allowed through those "pores" can be larger than the micron rating the filter originally had. Often MUCH larger.

Since the entire point of filtering is to ensure that no particles larger than a certain size are present in the oil after passing through the filter pressure filtering using an unsupported bag filter is an exercise in futility.

In applications where I needed to produce very large quantities of prefiltered wvo I simply multiply the number of bag filters in use and make them easy to replace and clean for reuse. A surprising amount of wvo can be gravity fed through a clean bag filter in a 24 hour period.

And in cases where a lot of filters had to be cleaned on a daily basis we just installed a dedicated washing machine and large grease trap. This was WAY less expensive than investing in industrial filter "support vessels"...which do not actually allow more total wvo through a bag filter before needing to be cleaned/replaced...they just allow it to go through quicker.

DIY filter sock housing:

So I had some of the same concerns about my first veggie oil. I didnt want to stretch the filter especially since I was adding some heat. What I did was take a scrap piece of 8" PVC pipe and drilled holes in it to allow the oil to escape. I used a .5" spade bit to drill holes along the lines I drew down the pipe. I hung the filter bag on the housing and didnt need to secure it at the top - it stayed in there. I hung this pipe from a beam in the garage and poured the oil through it. It worked fairly well.


oil in
\/
|------|
|******|
|******|
|******|
|******|
|******|
|******|
|******|
|------|
\ /
\ /

filtered stream

quote:

Originally posted by rkpatt:
Is it safe to bag filter with more than gravity ( no pressurized filter vessel ) only ? Look at this - http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=88433&item=5574243618&rd=1

This device seems a fancy way of clamping a filter bag around PVC pipe .

I think it's nothing but a bucket and a few pvc pipe fittings and a couple off the shelf parts from McMaster Carr.

I've dabbled with the McMaster parts - but the 4 inch size. For me, it worked great at the higher micron sizes, but my oil has allot of particulate matter - as I recall, at about 200 microns. I think it's flour from the batter (chinese restaurant).

Once you start pushing these things, the seams leak like a seive. Before they started to plug, they flowed faster than my pump - leaving some "air gap" at the top where there was no oil flow.

I could squeeze the oil in the filter and slosh it around and keep the flour knocked down in teh bag - and move lots of oil. As soon as the flour covered the whole bag, I was done for.

That's when I started dabbling with the hydrocyclone - and the direction I'm heading for high rate stuff. Otherwise, I'm just being patient enough to use gravity.

quote:

Originally posted by De:
I am just getting started and just filtered my first batch of WVO. So take what I say with a suspicious eye. I used a toilet paper filter.
De

Where did you find this filter???

Tony - Any more info and pitcures on the system you mentioned would be appreciated. I am convince that I will eventually need to go witha pressurized bag filter when I can get my hands on an affordable (salvage) bag filter vessel .

Tony posted 22 April 2005 07:02 AM -
"I have seen Andrew's WVO filtration system, which uses a gear pump to push the heated oil thru the filter. The filter is supported in a pressure chamber, so it doesn't rupture from the pressure.
I do not know the max operating pressure of his system."

RK you can make a filter housing out of pvc pipe. Use metal screen as a supporting structure. Get felt and have it sewn to fit circumference of pipe with screen underneath for support. The bag will expand to fit pipe and be supported on sides, you could do without the screen for support if you use pvc end and cut felt to length. I use a screen to leave a bit of space under my bag for extra holding spce before it is drawn through final filter.

quote:

Originally posted by rkpatt:
Tony - Any more info and pitcures on the system you mentioned would be appreciated. I am convince that I will eventually need to go witha pressurized bag filter when I can get my hands on an affordable (salvage) bag filter vessel .

Tony posted 22 April 2005 07:02 AM -
"I have seen Andrew's WVO filtration system, which uses a gear pump to push the heated oil thru the filter. The filter is supported in a pressure chamber, so it doesn't rupture from the pressure.
I do not know the max operating pressure of his system."

Andrew posts on this forum on occasions. Perhaps he will see this thread and provide the requested information.

Cleaning out the shop the other day I came across an oil filter unit I removed from a semi tractor a few years ago. It was deemed redundant as the main oil filter had been updated to a screw on canister type.
This oil filter housing uses a replaceable element and is about 2 gal in size. The lid is clamped on and sealed.
I thought it would be good to use for holding the bag type filters if a filter support basket was fabricated.
This filter is known to the trucking industry as a LUBERFINER. It was located under the battery box on a cab-over.

Hope to get to it soon.

Ken

Just spoke with Mcmaster about their filters.
I ordered the 5 1/2" x32" Polyfelt bags in the 5162K series. I specificially asked about the bags being suspended without wall or base support and if they could be used under pressure as well as static. They put their technical representative on and he stated very clearly that they can not only be suspended in a tank but that they can be filled under pressure while suspended in a tank!

Mine will be here Monday, 6 bags from 5-200 micron and $4.00 shipping. Not bad

They are located in Atlanta and the bag link is;

http://www.mcmaster.com/ctlg/DisplCtlgPage.asp?ReqTyp=C...PageFlip&ToolsetAct=

Clay

Clay...
Did he/she state how much pressure could be used..and at what pressure/temperature levels the micron rating would be compromised?

Was he/she aware you were planning to use them for wvo filtering?

The techs I have consulted with would not make the general statements the one you spoke with did. I have spoken with folks at RACOR that claimed to be "techs" until I challenged their answers.

Then I was put through to the REAL TECHS. These folks gave very specific answers to my very specific questions. In fact they DEMANDED very specific questions.

The other "tech" guy at Racor turned out to be a salesman. His answers turned out to be pretty much BS.

Dana,
Great question. His (Bill) initial designation is that these bags are designed for high pressure industrial applications. Since that is not real specific I just called him back to answer your question.

His response is that many applications are always looking for the right product and therefore some trial and error is part of the process. Specificially the regular model polyester felt bag is designed for 200 psi applications at the temps listed (300 degrees for mine)in a cylinder wall enviroment.

In a suspended enviroment where the bag is clamped with S.S. hose clamps to a strong tube (1" SS for me) pressures up to 50 PSI are well within the capability of the material and construction of the bag to not only survive but to maintain the micron rating.

That is alot of pressure and the answer is not absolute but this inhouse product applications specialist feels that this product is more than capable of it.

If more margin is needed they offer the heavy duty versions that are "designed to filter heavy metallic particles and extremely viscous liquids such as tar without tearing. Interwoven polyester mesh provides extra strength to hold heavy particles."

I was thinking that something under 10 psi would be nice to speed up the process so I am encouraged at the prospects. I intend to use the long 32" bags so that they will be partially suspended in the filtered oil early on in the filtering process. That will neutralize some of the downforce.

To make a check I would recommend a second filtering of the oil with the same rated micron bag and look for any increased pressure or visual evidence of pass thru of the first bag.

Clay

Yes he is aware of the WVO application.

quote:

To make a check I would recommend a second filtering of the oil with the same rated micron bag and look for any increased pressure or visual evidence of pass thru of the first bag.

Good idea...and possibly even using a paper media filter of known rating to compare to.

I think that at 10 psi you will find no problems. I envisioned much higher pressures being anticipated. Still...a safety filter of the same micron rating your vehicle has might be cheap insurance.