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Things you can do to get maximum engine life from a VO converted diesel.

This topic can be found at:
http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/159605551/m/2411025012

September 12, 2007, 02:03 AM
Carl_upnorth
Things you can do to get maximum engine life from a VO converted diesel.
quote:
Use a Turbine Engine.

A turbine engine only has one moving part and does not wear quickly. Just change the bearings once every 30,000 to 60,000 miles.


Yah, we'll just go down to airforce surplus and buy a small turbine.... Roll Eyes


..... UBC ..... hammers, square, chisel, and 25lb bags!
'86 f-250 with 190K miles! Rebuild on way. Take off ext cab, put on crew cab, custom short box. Still cheaper than new!
Re-starting after set backs.
September 12, 2007, 08:42 PM
3literRabbit
Jay Lenno and GM are developing a turbine car to run on B100. Chrysler did one in 60/70's
but it was deemed impractical.
More power to you if you turn it into reality.
One question to you, if you are consdering
the building of an efficient vehicle why would you not consider aerodynamics?
And while you are at it, you might suggest
to the USPS to recycle their trash (90% paper profucts) as most offices have no programs in place.

Good luck to you!
September 13, 2007, 12:23 AM
dang10010
How did this conversation turn to turbine engines. Either contribute to the conversation or start a new thread. Jeesh.
September 14, 2007, 08:51 PM
Carl_upnorth
I agree lets get back on topic I want and enjoy speeding up my learning curve.

What I meant above is I have seen Underfunded's request form money several times now and telling someone to use a turbine when most of us have to stay on a budget lest we upset our other halves and lose our homefront support. Turbine's are expensive so leave it to Jay and GM.


..... UBC ..... hammers, square, chisel, and 25lb bags!
'86 f-250 with 190K miles! Rebuild on way. Take off ext cab, put on crew cab, custom short box. Still cheaper than new!
Re-starting after set backs.
September 20, 2007, 01:11 AM
"STEVEL"
Nobody replied to my suggestion to advance engine timing. Wouldn't advancing complete the combustion better and cause less unburnt VO in the engine, thus not contaminating the oil and keeping polymerized oil off the engine parts?
September 20, 2007, 04:10 PM
vegburner.co.uk
Hello Steve,

Advancing the timing should help, figuring out by how much is a different matter....

Crossbones described how to use glow plugs for this.

GLOW PLUG TUNING

I think somewhere between 2 - 4 degrees advance should be good for most engines. But I'm sort of plucking figures out of the air.

Of course when running on diesel the engine would be less ideal, in extreme cases there is a risk of causing some damage if driven hard on diesel.




www.obed.org.uk Open Biofuel Engine Development - Collaborative biofuel engine tuning.
September 20, 2007, 04:14 PM
johno
Advancing the timing without knowing what's happening inside the combustion chamber risks damaging the engine. If pressure peaks before TDC, then you lose power, lose efficiency, and overstress the crankshaft. The combustion process is supposed to finish before the fuel droplets reach the cylinder walls, which has little to do with timing. Timing has to be quite retarded (or way advanced) for the heat of compression to be too low for complete combustion. Generally speaking, diesel engines cannot be tuned "by ear" like a spark ignition engine can. Potentially destructive timing settings sound "normal". A crank angle sensor and cylinder pressure transducer are the usual minimum instrumentation needed for a manufacturer to determine the best timing setting. Crossbones has reported good success using the glowplugs as sensors. A really well equipped shop might have those things, but not most hobbiests. Using the stock settings is a conservative way to avoid damaging settings. Advancing the timing without coinfidence that you are safe to do so seems dangerous to me. The necessary confidence might be from reliable recomendtations, or good instrumentation. OTOH, if you do advance the timing on your own engine, and it works better (defining "better" is a different topic) would obviously be worth while. Unfortunately the inability to know how much you advanced it, for the benefit of others, is a disadvantage.
Cheers,
JohnO
October 05, 2007, 06:44 AM
Mikey07005
I apologize in advance for my rant.

Lets say you go to underfunded.com, You love the idea on there and decide to donate.

WHO GETS THE MONEY? How about naming a person responsible or is this a way to scam the SVO/WVO community out of their money because of their interest in the subject.

Sounds like those donation scams to me...

My apologies again for getting off topic.
-Michael
October 25, 2007, 06:17 PM
mwmarcotte
This is great but scary information for someone seriously looking to convert. I am scheduled to have my 02 F250 (7.3) outfitted with the greasecar system on 1 Nov. My truck has only 120,000 miles and is in excellent mechanical condition. I'm now having second thoughts though. The greasecar tech's tell me their system with a heated tank and filter system and their "block" heater as well as their purge system that I'll have no worries. Even my son's college diesel mechanic instructor is warning me against it. With diesel prices the way they are I really want ot switch but but is it worth it.
October 25, 2007, 06:39 PM
Windsolar
Chreck out www.plantdrive.com. Great conversion, heaters and filters and excellent support. I have been running with no problem, got 5000 miles on my first filter (vormax) and test oil religiously for water. Read the post on filtering oil and getting good oil. At least know the source. Chris
October 26, 2007, 10:32 AM
danalinscott
quote:
The greasecar tech's tell me their system with a heated tank and filter system and their "block" heater as well as their purge system that I'll have no worries.


Any person who claims to be a "tech" and tells you THAT is actually a salesman. A technician would tell you what the possible problems are and how to avoid them. A salesman most likely will not.

quote:
Chreck out www.plantdrive.com. Great conversion


Is it really appropriate to insert an advertisement for Plantdrive in this technical discussion? Buying a PlantDrive conversion is no gaurentee that you will avoid serious problems. The moderator was kind enough to make this important discussion a sticky. Lets not abuse it.
November 05, 2007, 11:35 AM
dinosaurdoctor
For 97 Jetta td with the knocking Jetta I hope the shop took the time to crack each injector line one at a time to see if your noise increased or quit entirely indicating wrist pin or rod noise.
If they think its the I.P.they can pull it and have it bench tested at a fuel injection shop. Also have the injectors checked for opening pressure, timing also is effected by opening pressure. Sometimes wait and see is a very expensive phrase.

On the coking front, I have always believed that combustion chamber temps being too low is what caused this,so maybe a sniff of alcohol would up the chamber temps enough to prevent coking. Hmmmmmm pinky to the corner of the mouth.
And lastly...A turbine ?? the last time I had anything to do with them they were terrible on fuel economy.. Has that changed???
November 05, 2007, 12:41 PM
97JettaTD
My Jetta is still sounding the same.. I've come to the conclusion that there will be some process of ellimination to cure this. So I'm going with lifters first. That's about $100 for all four and I can do it myself - just need time and ambition. After they are changed I'll deside from there what's next.


99 A3 TDI. Two tank system . FPHE,6 port Pollack,HOH. 330,000km.
November 15, 2007, 03:23 PM
Spoon
When I first read your post that is the same conclusion I came to. When the vehicle is cold the thickness of the oil is allowing the lifter to pump up. Once the vehicle come up to temp then the oil thins and the lifter struggles to provide the lift needed for the rocker and this is where the ticking may come into play.

It is debatable that the VO caused the lifter to go south, if that is truly the problem. Good luck.
November 23, 2007, 09:56 AM
HoldOnTight
Dana,
Good list. Many things are implied by some items in the list. Clarification/expansion could be warranted for the newbee/novice.

My suggestion to add to:
4. Do not switch to VO fuel until your engine is at normal operating temperature. The cooler the combustion chamber (piston,head,walls) are the faster ring/land/groove coking progresses.

It is equally important to revert back to diesel early enough to completely burn the UVO if you don't have a purge capability and if you do have a purge capability, then to adequately purge to ensure UVO is not just diluted, but completely flushed out of the fuel rails. The point is not to have startup with any UVO.


Richard
99.5 F-250, K&N Air Filter, 4 in exhaust, Power Programmer and stacked with a 6-Gun...on VO
December 14, 2007, 08:47 PM
Hairball
I'm confused.

Sorry, total newbie here.

One of you says run your oil at 250-275 degrees and the other says don't go over 200...

how the heck am I supposed to know who's right?
December 16, 2007, 09:25 PM
danalinscott
quote:
Originally posted by Hairball:
I'm confused.

Sorry, total newbie here.

One of you says run your oil at 250-275 degrees and the other says don't go over 200...

how the heck am I supposed to know who's right?


My reccomendation is based on the Acrevo Report and my own research. I don't know what Craigs reccomendation is based upon.

Perhaps he is talking about pre-IP temps. If so I would caution about not exceending 180°F pre-IP. In fact I rarely see any advantage to exceeding 150-160°F since VO is likely to lose heat as it passes through the IP at temps higher than that.
December 29, 2007, 09:57 AM
tb03
What difference does it make if you have an older, non-turbo diesel? Obviously the newer TDIs will be much tighter and have smaller tolerances. I have a mechanically injected 6.2 diesel in my Chevy truck. Would I have less worries compared to the TDIs?


'90 Chevy Silverado 6.2 diesel
December 31, 2007, 07:44 AM
97JettaTD
My older turbo non tdi engine got hot faster than my 99 TDI because of the less effiecent engine. hot faster is a good thing when you're trying to reach operating temp so you can switch over to veggie. I changed the thermostat because I thought it was too slow getting up to temp. Now in the winter I can't switch over to veg because of my 15 mile drive to work the engine only gets to temp in the last 5 miles. So it's not worth switching over concidering I have to purge.


99 A3 TDI. Two tank system . FPHE,6 port Pollack,HOH. 330,000km.
December 31, 2007, 06:17 PM
misnomer
Dana, I haven't started using SVO yet. I am in the process of putting together my own kit. In a forum I read about using water injection when running SVO not for the powerboost but for the removal of carbon deposits. His idea was that it was a preventative measure on his car. Plus a adding a bit of methanol adds a nice boost when traveling through the mountains. I was wondering if you had experimented with water injection as a means to prevent carbon from building up?

Thanks for the information you posted.

Didn't Castrol start out using castor bean oil? Do they still? did they switch to petroleum over the years? I was thinking that would be a reasonable priced oil to use with biofuels if they still did.