As a new user of wvo, here's what I see. Every person I talk to about my Suburban is interested in learning how it works. Of those, it might be 1 in 20 that shows enough interest in learning that they might want to look into a system. Of those, most will be turned away by the cost and learning curve.

So, I think that most people who start using wvo are already somewhat educated by reading online. The few that don't do any research, just spec out and buy a system, are in my opinion a small %.

Still, even after lots of research, there is a lot to learn. I know in my case I'm doing some things right, some wrong, we'll see if I'm careful enough to make my engine last. I think so, but I'm guessing others that have had failures have thought they were doing things right, too.

See, I don't doubt that mechanics are seeing wvo related failures. For one mechanic to see a lot seems surprising, since its hard to find more than a handful of people in any town that are using it. But, I know when I've talked to some new users they've used the "diesels will burn anything, don't worry about how hot the oil is, etc., etc." approach, and I'm guessing they'll be the failures after just a few thousand miles.

I think the warning is great. Perhaps it will scare off those less committed to a proper install. Maybe he is not a mechanic but a renderer trying to remove some homebrew competition. I predict the market will soon be flooded w/ barely used, second hand Biopro's and other pre-made processors and equipment. Once people try getting grease & realize what a messy, smelly job it can be, I suspect many will give up. I just saw diesel for a measly $3.89 gallon this weekend by the way.

What would you suggest the "community" do that it is not already?[/QUOTE]

i think something that would be a step in the right direction would be to put a topic at the start of this forum, that STAYS there like the other three,that explains the acronyms you use, remember your veterans these are second nature to you the newbie doesnt know what they mean.

i think another topic that should stay at the top would explain the various methods of filtering, dewatering and seperating. i know theres already a category for that but have you read it lately? not very useful. this is probably the hardest topic to cover because of all the different methods everyone uses and there isnt ANY one method that will work for everyone, but maybe something like; if you do this then next your gonna want to do this, after that you need to do this. also,and i know this will be highly contraversal,but time frames, not exact hours,minutes,&seconds but a general idea. let the newbie know about how much time needs to be committed to this. this is something ive wondered about but wouldnt ask because i knew id get chastised for it.

and please please please dont anyone take offense to this im not condemning anyone in any way shape or form, im just giving a newbies opinion being on the outside looking in

good suggestions

.

Sounds just like a guy on another forum

Real hard core anti-veggie guy.
Jumps on every veggie thread and tries to warn people away.

Says he has experience using veggie, says he is a diesel mechanic, says veggie is a "fad"
Acts like he is an expert.

Real dramatic and vague when he posts.

Lots of similarities.

Is this just a common mentality ?

Do you guys run into many of these people ?


RichC

.

I am trying to warn people. But no good deed goes unpunished. I see people are calling me a liar. Fine take the chance with WVO!!!! But where is your proof it works well???? Have you pulled your injectors??? How many miles have you run WVO??? I am so busy with fixing engines that WVO is coking and ruining, I will try to get a video up soon.

I am not being mean or rude, so please return the courtesy. I am only trying to warn people of what I see.

quote:

Originally posted by Zedd:
The vast majority of Waste Fryer Junk users claim they have run for thousands of miles and yet none, Rich included, have taken apart their engine after prolonged periods of WVO use (single tank or dual) and posted it for people to see.

I really think your stretching things saying that. How many people do you know that have ever taken any engine that was running fine apart just to show it was in fact in good condition?
That is a pretty poor point IMHO and undermines any credibility you have here which frankly I don't see as being a lot.

There are many people that have run long periods of time or big miles on veg without problem. I'm one of them.
Like many people, I have an old car and if it died tomorrow whether I was running veg or dino, it would still be said the car did well to run as long as it has. Engines die and sometimes after short lives even on Dino.
People make stupid mistakes when running veg which creates problems but I had a neighbor once that topped up the water on her 1 day old car....through the big black cap on the Rocker cover!!!

I used to get annoyed at people saying veg was no good but now I'm fine with it. The more people you naysayers put off, the happier I am and the longer veg will be available to me to keep ruining my engine.

When it does finally Die, I'll be happy to show what it looks like after all the miles it has done already and list all the things I am knowingly doing against the veg oil rules and say look how long the thing lasted despite doing all these things wrong!

I'll also calculate all the fuel I have used from the records I keep and work out just how huge a pile of cash this veg burner has saved me.
I don't think I am going to be anything but gratefull and way in front even when I pay for an engine rebuild.

Keep up the good work with your warnings !!

Internet forums are weird places. They allow people to make up entire identities for themselves and basically claim anything they want. As a result they are breeding grounds for people that have an urge to stir up hornet's nests, create controversy, etc... This guy is obviously one of those folks. It's impossible to know his true motivation, but I'm sure he's having plenty of fun checking the replies every so often.

However, I think that the WVO world can only benefit from "Debbie Downers" like these people. Not to mention the folks who blow up their TDIs on WVO. One of the threads I read through mentioned that the guy's oil change interval was 7000 miles!!! That's utter insanity! Even before I converted to WVO I changed my oil every 5000, no exceptions. It works quite well for me now. In any event, keep spreading the word that WVO=engine death and keep grenading those TDIs people. My Powerstroke is thirsty.

Expert Zero:

You are entitled to your opinion, but you need to base claims on facts. Here is a detailed study of a modern DI engine running a properly maintained and modified single tank system. It includes a tear-down, as I recall. It was run on rapeseed oil, not WVO, but the principal conclusions apply to WVO that is PROPERLY FILTERED AND DEWATERED. The tests were after 265,000 KM. Real low mileage, and obviously overdue for a major catastrophe.

There are four big problems with running a diesel on WVO, the proper modifications for the engine for burning that fuel in the climate local to its use, the driving habits of the person behind the wheel, the proper filtering and dewatering of the fuel, and the proper maintenance of the engine. If one of these is not properly applied for the use of this fuel, problems will result. This may also be said of diesel fuel. If someone drives (well, attempts to drive) a diesel fueled car with a leaky injector like it is a muscle car, the engine will be ruined.

Most times the kinds of problems that you so expertly observe are caused by one thing, the idiot behind the wheel; not the use of WVO, but the MIS-USE.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 240volvo,

quote:

have taken apart their engine after prolonged periods of WVO use (single tank or dual) and posted it for people to see.

I did have mine apart at 85,000 WVO+SVO miles, and took pictures too, but then lost the camera.
However two mechanics also examined the pistons and head and said it looked 'normal for it's age' and in 'very good condition'.

There was thin carbon deposits on about 50% of the total surface area. The rest was clean.
Engine goes 5-7,000 / quart of motor oil, and has average power and economy for it's make.

Th ehead was off to repair a stripped glow plug.
All lifters were replaced, 2 were worn, the other 6 looked good. Std maintenance otherwise so far. 165,000 miles total.

Jeez John,

That guy got you going didn't he?
Please, everyone, this forum is not a place to attack anyone or anything. It is a place of discussion, exploration and learning.
Please take your anger, personal judgements and emotional baggage and let them go somewhere else.
I have gained a lot of wisdom from many of you on this forum and I am so grateful, especially from Dana,and you too John. So much that I have helped many people with a few of their problems. Kindness and gratitude and appreciation go along way, and anger, self-righteousness and the other stuff doesn't.
With respect, kindness, gratitude and appreciation for everyone contributing to this forum,
Global Heart, '82 Merz 300SD, '83 Merz 300D 17K on WVO

TCR1016, it's too bad you've had/seen problems. I have proof it works, 4 years of running my 1985 Benz on almost straight veggie. I have saved 2-3 times the car's price in fuel costs so far, so if it exploded tomorrow I wouldn't cry. I have almost 2 years on my Suburban, 2 tank conversion, paid $6000 for that including the conversion cost, and have saved somewhere around $4500 in fuel costs already. No problems. I am about to convert a newer Benz, and I expect it will last many years, too.

Pick your risk level and be happy. If you don't like the risk, don't use VO.

quote:

But where is your proof it works well???? Have you pulled your injectors??? How many miles have you run WVO???

I can't prove that SVO (dried and filtered "WVO") works well, but my Jetta has now travelled roughly 200,000 miles on two different SVO conversions. At 300,000 total miles I swapped the original engine due to declining compression, but kept the original injector pump. The injectors that were in the old engine looked identical to the injectors in the low-mileage used replacement engine. I decided to keep the old injectors as spares, and am running the ones that came in the used engine.
The "new" engine is continuing to run as well as the "old" engine, but with less smoke and fewer oil leaks. Perhaps your concern that I'm ruining my engine is well founded, but at this rate I won't know for another 150,000 miles, if then.

TCR1016 wrote:

quote:

The problems do not come right away, but in the 30K to 50K miles.

Thanks for your warning. Lets take this from the math angle . . .

Using the following numbers:
Miles Driven = 30,000
Ave MPG = 25
"Ave" $/gal diesel (I wish) = $3.75

30000/25 = 1200 gallons of fuel used

1200 x $3.75 = $4500 worth of fuel

Is it worth it? I guess it depends on the person . . .

Considering that there are many single and twin tank converted direct injection vehicles in Europe that have done hundreds of thousands of miles without problems - I'd say ensure your fuel is of good quality, your engine suitably modified , in good health and suitably maintained and problems should be minimal.