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Dieselcraft centrifuge works great -My filter and dewater rig
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Regarding the tank or drum. I am using thru the hull boat drains. You can buy them in 3/4 inch sizes or what ever might please you. I am using both the HDPE plastic and the bronze. My thermostats are set for a max of 170 degrees F. I don't know how many hours I have on the set up but the tank is good for operations to 180 degrees. I have not had any problems with temperature. I have the drum tilted probably about 10 degrees with the thru hulls at the bottom of the slope.

As the famous Belgian Detective Poriot said "to let the little grey cells rest." So.

Where I live I can find numerous well water psi tanks. Enclosed is a picture of a large one. I wanted a vaccum tank so I cut it open to remove the bladder inside then I welded it back together. I finally realized one of these tanks with a rounded bottom and a pre-installed threaded connector would be the ideal tank/drum to use with my CF. I have a smaller tank than in the photo that I cut apart and reassembled. I am going to cut the very top off and check the volume. I want a smaller tank to take with me this fall so I can process on the road. In addition I propose to weld a flat ring or collar on the cut off end to stablize it and hopefully control splashes over the side. As you can see in the photo there is an attached collar on the base to support the tank upright. I do have one more tank that has not been modified. Perhaps I will just cut the top of that one and pull the bladder guts out of it for my first trial.

We can have some have some pretty lively discussions here so I don't want too many guys falling on my very tender head. I was checking out the pump situation. I called Haldex and the guys at Surpluscenter.com as well as Northern Tools. The Haldex/Barnes bidirectional cast iron pump sold by Northern has ball bearing innerds but no Viton seals. It is good to run at our temps up to 180 degrees. There has been one on sale, may end today, for $89, normally $105. Baileysales.com has a couple of models with viton seals for I think about $114. Surplus Center sells a large selection of pumps. The Dynamic models are good for our temps. I can not remember if they have viton seals. It said all aluminum I did not ask if that meant the gears too. There was NOT a consensus on particle size to be pumped. The distributors talked about 10 micron. But Haldex did not seems to feel pumping wvo was going to be a problem. He did say don't even think about letting it run dry. Said it had a case drain and if it sat a long time with out use then basically hand oil it before you put it into use.

I ordered the Haldex/Barnes from Northern Tool, item #10565 .258 cu in displacement for $89. It is rated at 2 gal/min, 2,000 rpm at pressure. I will post my experience with it. I will run it for the time being with my washer motor at 1750 rpm. Yes, I realize it has more output than I need at the present time. If need be I will reduce the pump rpm. Somewhere in my readings I saw some minimum rpms of around 700.

I mounted my CF to a metal angle iron inside my drum. Next I tried a couple of orientations of a 3/4" tee to handle the discharge so I could catch the output during spool down. With the tee horizontal the chamber flooded and would not function. Next I put the tee on with a straight drop down through a ball valve. The horizontal outlet is for any discharge during spool down. This works but during warm up if the oil is cool and viscous it may slow the CF down. After about 120 degrees it seems to work reliably. It would be better as someone else mentioned to use a 1 inch fitting. Oh, well. I weld my tees on so I am not too anxious to cut and redo them. (I heat soak the tee to about 800 degrees before I weld it on).

Here is the converted tank. You can see the weld seam where I put it back together. I'll post another picture of the smaller tank. It is raining too hard to get it now.

Dana

Dana

ImageConverted-Psi-Tank.jpg (151 Kb, 149 downloads) Converted Tank
 
Registered: February 12, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hey there Penguy,

Looks like a used propane/LPG tank would do the same job?

I woild love a diagramme or picks of how you mounted the dieselcraft and heater pipe inside the tank.

I am in need of a mobile filtering and dewatering unit - with the addition of a bag filter sized hole in the top so you can prefilter oil to 5 microns when pouring it into the processor - this might be just the ticket.

Would also be great to mount the pump in a box welded to the bottom or side so that t is an all in one unit.

What do you think?

Would love any more comments on this.
 
Registered: July 08, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by danalinscott:
....As far as removal of slighlty polymerized VO with the DC I do not interpret this as a problem. To the contrary I think it might have useful application. ....
Dana, are you thinking that a CF like the D-Craft might be ablt to remove veg particles that have begun to polmyerize? Sounds like a good new thread!


_________________________
If you believe you can't YOUR RIGHT;

But equally so.... if you believe you can, YOUR RIGHT as well.
 
Location: North Tx | Registered: November 23, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Hamish Gale:
I am in need of a mobile filtering and dewatering unit - with the addition of a bag filter sized hole in the top so you can prefilter oil to 5 microns when pouring it into the processor - this might be just the ticket.


Don't prefilter to 5 microns, that eliminates a great feature of the CF, no cleaning of bags needed. And 5m bags are very slow. 150 micron screen is plenty when you dump it in.

quote:

Would also be great to mount the pump in a box welded to the bottom or side so that t is an all in one unit.


Yes thats real easy to do. Put some rubber washers in the mount or it might get loud due to the barrel acting as a resonator. Same with mounting the CF to the tank.


YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary, see www.burnveg.com/forum
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4
Zero fossil house- 100% solar power and heat.
 
Location: N. Colorado | Registered: August 31, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by jeepin, moggin Jessup (coachgeo):
Dana, are you thinking that a CF like the D-Craft might be ablt to remove veg particles that have begun to polmyerize? Sounds like a good new thread!


Yes I have tested that it does remove poly particles (when it gets very bad), discussed on the previous page.


YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary, see www.burnveg.com/forum
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4
Zero fossil house- 100% solar power and heat.
 
Location: N. Colorado | Registered: August 31, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by SunWizard:
quote:
Originally posted by jeepin, moggin Jessup (coachgeo):
Dana, are you thinking that a CF like the D-Craft might be ablt to remove veg particles that have begun to polmyerize? Sounds like a good new thread!


Yes I have tested that it does remove poly particles (when it gets very bad), discussed on the previous page.
I cant speak for him but I get the impression Dana is thinking it might could remove earlier stage polymerization BEFORE it gets as bad as you describe here.


_________________________
If you believe you can't YOUR RIGHT;

But equally so.... if you believe you can, YOUR RIGHT as well.
 
Location: North Tx | Registered: November 23, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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quote:
Originally posted by jeepin, moggin Jessup (coachgeo):
quote:
Originally posted by danalinscott:
....As far as removal of slighlty polymerized VO with the DC I do not interpret this as a problem. To the contrary I think it might have useful application. ....
Dana, are you thinking that a CF like the D-Craft might be ablt to remove veg particles that have begun to polmyerize? Sounds like a good new thread!


I agree.
Using commercial centrifuges glycerine can be removed from biodiesel. This is also a claim made for the DC filter. Using those same commercial centrifuges I have been able to remove the polymerized portion of slightly polymerized VO.

Also...I have noticed that centrifugal filters similar to the DC filter have removed polymerized (partially combusted) VO contamination from crankcase oil.

These led me to believe it might be possible to remove polymerization contamination from VO with a DC but apparrently it can only remove severely polymerized VO as can any filter.

If you want to start a new discussion on centrifugal separation of polymerized VO I will contribute what I can.
 
Location: Central MN..Brrrrrr! | Registered: November 06, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hamish

I don't think the propane cyl idea would work too well for a CF tank. I think the volume is to small, 20 lb cyl at 5 gal. Even my 40 lb cyl at 10 gal seems a little small. Plus it seems tall in the height to width ratio. In my photo of the vac tank you can see the tank when upright is about 4 feet high plus the base. I want to put what ever tank I use in my truck with the cap on the bed. That limits my max height. I can put a 50 gal drum in the bed upright with the cap on.

Sun's design for the heating elements works very well for me. My present planning will include welded tabs on the tank to hang the heater on. Not inside the tank. Another consideration is to supply engine heat to the CF tank for on the move processing. I would be interested to know how Sun does it. I don't know what I will do about an enclosure but a welded box would protect everything. However, resonation would need to be address.

My plan is to weld in a platform at the top of the tank to mount the CF with a 1 inch pipe tee this time. Because of the confining space under the bed cap I am going to cut away the tank to reach the valves from the side. I am glad Sun mentioned using an isolation mount. This thing could really sing.

No photos yet, may take a while.

In the future in order to reduce confusion of knowing which Dana is posting I am going to stop signing my name to my posts. I hope that helps.
 
Registered: February 12, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I have gone through this entire thread and picked up a lot of useful info. I have made a lot of notes in a notebook about pumps, motors, heaters, gauges, etc, and referance to page #'s and would like to know if there is a way to go to a specific page for it's content. I have tried and haven't been able to pull it off yet. By the way, this is my very first post, and I've really enjoyed reading this although I thought I was never going to get to the end. Great thread!!! Thanks!
 
Registered: August 07, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by poppajim:
....would like to know if there is a way to go to a specific page for it's content. ...
Welcome to the board. I think I might be missunderstanding your question cause the solution is so simple. On the top and bottom right of each page is a set of numbers you can hit to page you back or forward. True it only jumps a few pages at a time though or using the underlined dots jumps you half way back/forward thru all the remaining pages from where you are.


_________________________
If you believe you can't YOUR RIGHT;

But equally so.... if you believe you can, YOUR RIGHT as well.
 
Location: North Tx | Registered: November 23, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I know how to do that. I'm talking about going to a SPECIFIC page. If yo're on e-bay and have many pages to search all the page #'s are at the bottom like here and you click on "next" to go to the next page. But if you want a specific page you go all the way to the right and it says "jump to" with a box, you type in the page # you want, press "enter", and it jumps to that page. That's what I'm looking for. If we don't have that feature we should get it. It would really make searching these larege threads better to search. Thanks for your reply, as I do appreciate your comeback. Jim
 
Registered: August 07, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Here is how you can go to a specific page: Hit any of the page buttons on the bottom right. Then notice the page# is the last thing on the URL in your browser. Simply go up there, change the page# URL to whatever page you want, hit enter and it goes there instantly.


YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary, see www.burnveg.com/forum
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4
Zero fossil house- 100% solar power and heat.
 
Location: N. Colorado | Registered: August 31, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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My thoughts about P/S pumps and pulleys.

Anything about WVO is recycling AND, save money and the sport of it.

One cost is the motor and pump for the centrifuge to work. You might buy it in one piece hower it's not the real sports about WVO.

Here in this thred we often talk about pulleys diameters and motor rpm.

Isn't it simpler to talk about the P/S pumps rpm rather than ODm-pulley (m=motor), ODp-pulley (pump) and the rpm of the motor.

Let us put it this way. You got a motor with a fixed pulley - cheap (shafts and wooddroff may vary and pulleys may also attched with heat so let's try to keep that moter and pulley.)

Let's say you got a motor with pulley with outer diameter of ODm. What pulley on the pump do you have to look for so it fits the OC20s pump?

Looking att most posts here the rpm on the P/S pumps seemes to be 950 to 1200 rpm. Lets say pump average 1100 rpm.

If you have got a motor with pulley ODm (outer diameter pulley on motor) with RPMm (rpm motor) you might look for a pump with ODp (outer diameter pulley - pump)

(ODm x RPMm) = (ODp)x 1100

That makes the pulley on the pump to be near:

ODp = (ODm x RPMm) / 1100

This was made to simplify searching and saving mony.

Am I wrong tell me! More thinking about pump-rpms?


Swede!
 
Location: Sweden | Registered: July 03, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Well, I just finished this thread, four days after starting it. I have not seen it mentioned how you all maintain your CF's I know you don't just shut it down and leave it until you use it again. Do you need to take them apart and clean all the oil out of them or do you run a cleaner of some sort through them? I may only use mine every two weeks and I am sure oil would poly in the CF and pump.


Muleears
Hampton Roads, VA USA
85 MB 300D, 260K mi. and 83 300SD 158 mi. WVO Blend
Very tolerant wife

 
Registered: May 22, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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It's best to clean the CF right away. The biggest problem I have is that I'll leave the CF running and there always seems to be some sort of failure that comes up while I'm away for an hour or so. If the pump fails (recently I had a huge bug get stuck in my pump) then the oil by the heating elements starts frying to a crisp because of no flow. Last night I had a hose from the 55 gal drum to the pump fail. Now I have fried oil in my system. It's actually been a pretty frustrating experience; I have rebuilt my rig several times trying avoid one problem after another. I'll have to another rebuild tonight. I still believe the CF is the best way to filter oil though.

I have kind of crazy idea for my next build. I notice the connections that go to my pump from the heating element black steel tube gets extremely hot, I'm going to route the pipe that goes from the pump to the heating element tube through 5 or so gallons of water to keep my pump cool.
 
Registered: April 18, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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How do you clean it? A complete teardown or just wipe out the rotor and clean the orifices?


Muleears
Hampton Roads, VA USA
85 MB 300D, 260K mi. and 83 300SD 158 mi. WVO Blend
Very tolerant wife

 
Registered: May 22, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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The CF you take apart all the parts. I use the existing oil in the rotor and paper towels to clean it. I put a paper clip size wire through the jets everytime to make sure they are not plugged. I also use q tips for the small areas I can't get my fat fingers into.

To clean the crispy oil chucks out of the system requires a complete tear down.
 
Registered: April 18, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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A complete teardown is how you wipe the rotor, and its very easy, it takes about 1 minute. You remove a nut from the top, the 3 parts separate, then I wipe the rotor and 2 base parts with a rag. If there is > 1/8" thick layer of goo in the rotor, I scrape it out roughly with 1 pass of a flat bladed screwdriver before I wipe. This is described and the parts are shown in pics on my summary on page 1. I always clean after every shutdown.

I don't clean the orifices since clogging hasn't been a problem, even on the nastiest VO that I can find. Probably since I suck from dumpsters through a 150 micron screen and the orifices in the CF are 500 microns. But it would take an added 10 seconds to poke a paper clip through the 2 holes if you like.

I only use it once every 2-4 weeks and have never had any poly problems in the pump or CF. The CF has no VO in it while not in use. The VO in the pump and hose is not exposed to any light or air which would cause it to poly, since there are closed valves on both ends of the 2 hoses coming from it.

I have never had any failure in over a year of using it, so I guess I used the correct hoses and design right from the start. I usually leave it unattended for 3-4 hours each run.


YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary, see www.burnveg.com/forum
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4
Zero fossil house- 100% solar power and heat.
 
Location: N. Colorado | Registered: August 31, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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Sun Wizard, thanks on how TO go to a specific page. You're "THE MAN".
 
Registered: August 07, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by SunWizard:
and have never had any poly problems in the pump or CF.


This is as good as any as an opening to this discussion.

As I mentioned I was going to look at the possiblity of polymerizing oil being formed in extended CF runs.

Below is a photo of a dispersion test. The spot on the left was oil cleaned to 100 micron and was heated to 150 degrees F and held while it settled for 6 days.

The oil on the right was the same batch following being run through the CF at 90 psi, 24 hours at 160 degrees, and 8 hours at 180 degrees F. This extended run is well beyond even my normal, but I wanted to see how much more carbon I'd collect after running at 180.

Each spot was 1/2 ml of oil placed after collecting at 160 degrees (I suspect they both cooled significantly before being deposited). The spot was free to go as big as it could go, no time limit.

I hate to say this, but despite the significant difference, the only conclusion is that more evaluation is needed.

But...

The post-CF spot was not tacky, anymore than the pre-CF.

Could be other factors that caused the wider expansion of the pre-CF spot, like water? But it could be that the post-CF oil penetrated deeper so was actually thinner, and that explains why the center looks darker?

The darker center spot within the post-CF sample looks evident in the photo, but I didn't notice it in the real thing. It showed up that way in all the photos, but could be the angle, or position relative to windows. But I can't be sure that it isn't actually polymerized oil.

I'm going to repeat this, and add a timed flow through an orifice test.

I'm open to all your thoughts, and FWIW, I have enough confidence in that extended run oil to fuel my truck and let my wife drive it to Texas. ummmm I might cut open the truck filter and take a look when she gets home next week...



2002 F250 Vegistroke now with the new V3 module!
 
Location: Wyoming | Registered: July 25, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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