Dieselcraft centrifuge works great -My filter and dewater rig

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Posted

quote:
Originally posted by canolafunola:
Hey great job Sunwizard and JOAT. What kind of bearings does it use? Any data on the life expectancy of the unit?

It uses a bronze bearing that is the full height of the rotor (about 3") and the oil comes out inside the bearing, lubricating it well. (the friction is so low it continues to spin for several minutes after you shut off the pump) I think it will last a long time, but haven't seen any data anywhere. The 18 wheelers that use this often run 24 hours a day so they put a lot more hours on them than we ever will.

Location: N. Colorado | Registered: 31 August 2006

Ignored post by SunWizard posted

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Posted

quote:
Originally posted by JOAT:
It does not truly dewater IMO, but the jets and frothing effect aid evaporation considerably, with multiple passes. I saw no evidence of water in the sediment collection area, just a decentr amount of visible steam.

To clarify it doesn't dewater like a centrifuge does (in the rotor), it does dewater like Tim's flash evaporator by passing hot, high pressure oil through the 2 small orifices. And it is producing lots of visible steam at a much lower temperature (120F) than I expected.

(edit- see page 12, it does dewater like a "true" centrifuge but it keeps the water in the rotor, it may be possible to remove water/acids/etc. without a mistwash if you capture the output at pump shutoff)

This message has been edited. Last edited by: SunWizard,

Location: N. Colorado | Registered: 31 August 2006

Ignored post by SunWizard posted

JOAT

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Posted

quote:
Originally posted by SunWizard:
quote:
Originally posted by JOAT:
It does not truly dewater IMO, but the jets and frothing effect aid evaporation considerably, with multiple passes. I saw no evidence of water in the sediment collection area, just a decentr amount of visible steam.

To clarify it doesn't dewater like a centrifuge does (in the rotor), it does dewater like Tim's flash evaporator by passing hot, high pressure oil through the 2 small orifices. And it is producing lots of visible steam at a much lower temperature (120F) than I expected.

Unfortunately it doesn't fully flash all the water the way a flash evaporator would. Possible if you had the oil heated above waters boiling point it may. Something I want to try after I get higher temp hoses in my setup.

Actually I haven't heard any evidence that Buuuuuds truly dewaters either (visible removed water from oil that had no visible signs of water). Sputter testing the residue isn't accurate as water in the sediment will sputter.

Location: The West Coast | Registered: 12 March 2005

Ignored post by JOAT posted

JOAT

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It's hard to get pictures of steam, but you can make out some of it in this pic.

Yeah, cold oil quickly fills the Centrifuge with hydrogenated and animal fat.

Location: The West Coast | Registered: 12 March 2005

Ignored post by JOAT posted

mobetta

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so it seems that this would not be suitable for one tanking or blenders who do not get thier oil up to temp before their onboard filters, unless they cold filter thru a sock filter first, maybe. besides, it seems that the added heat is really benificial to dewatering.

JOAT, do you mist/bubble wash first?

Be the change you hope to find in this world.-Gandhi

Location: location, location... | Registered: 04 November 2005

Ignored post by mobetta posted

JOAT

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So far I haven't ran a mist washed batch through the centrifuge, just heat settled and some barrel bottom junk.

I'm still experimenting with mist washing. Not really seeing any PH change in the water when I do, and it's a pain with partially hydrogenated oil. Will play with a mist wash batched in a week or two

Next batch will be a baking soda neutralized heat settled batch (heating as I type), then a magnesol batch. I'm curious to see how well it removes those type powders from the oil.

Location: The West Coast | Registered: 12 March 2005

Ignored post by JOAT posted

jeepin, moggin Jessup (coachgeo)

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Posted

quote:
Originally posted by JOAT:
...Next batch will be a baking soda neutralized heat settled batch (heating as I type), then a magnesol batch. I'm curious to see how well it removes those type powders from the oil.

Some or alot of your baking soda should not be powder any more cause it reacted with stuff in the oil. Matters how much you put in. Magnisol..... not sure if that stuff is intended to be a reactant like the base in baking soda would or if it something intended to ABSORB or Surround particular things in the oil. This will make a difference on how it ends up getting spun out.

Looking forward to your report(s)

WVO life pending still grrrr

Coach George
----------------------------------------
Originally Posted by anvil of Pirate4x4.com
your very informative reply has been noted. I think this is the same type of logic you used to draw your conclusion.

Place banana in your ear.
Observe that there is no alligators around.
Conclude bananas placed in ears keep aligators away.

Location: North Tx | Registered: 23 November 2002

Ignored post by jeepin, moggin Jessup (coachgeo) posted

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I solved the sealing of the water heater elements. Use a 1/16" thick by 1.25" ID metal washer first on the element, then a 1.5" ID washer with a 1/8" x 1.25" O-ring inside. The bigger washer acts like a retainer, preventing blowout. This seals great and has handled the high temp and pressure used with my rig.

So now I am using 2 - 4500 watt heater elements which gets the WVO hot real quick and makes both the centrifuge and the flash evaporator functions work better.

Location: N. Colorado | Registered: 31 August 2006

Ignored post by SunWizard posted

mobetta

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wizard- are you using any temp controls, or just running 2 4500 w elements on 120v= 2250 w total, @ 55 gph? any idea of exiting temps,how well it dewaters? good idea on reinforing the o-ring.

Be the change you hope to find in this world.-Gandhi

Location: location, location... | Registered: 04 November 2005

Ignored post by mobetta posted

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Posted

quote:
Originally posted by mobetta:
wizard- are you using any temp controls, or just running 2 4500 w elements on 120v= 2250 w total, @ 55 gph? any idea of exiting temps,how well it dewaters? good idea on reinforing the o-ring.

No temp controls just the 2 elements at 120v=2250w as you say. Exiting temp starts at 100F, and goes up to about 200F after 2 hours. Seems to level off around there due to losses to ambient 50F through the 55 gallon metal barrel, pipes etc.

Dewaters very well, I can see and hear the steam coming off the outlet of the centrifuge, and when it stops steaming it has passed the pan test for water each time. 3 batches so far. Seems like 4 passes through the centrifuge is a good amount for both dewater and to get the oil very clean. edit- and this is after a mist wash where I drained off most but left some visible water in the oil.

Location: N. Colorado | Registered: 31 August 2006

Ignored post by SunWizard posted

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I made another improvement to the design of this rig. I drilled a 3/4" hole about 6" down from the rim, and ran the supply pipe to the centrifuge through there, and didn't bolt it to the barrel. This made it much quieter since the drum doesn't resonate anymore. It also means you can save $30 by not buying the mount with the centrifuge.

edit- It also means I can put a lid on the drum without taking off the centrifuge like I had been doing.

Location: N. Colorado | Registered: 31 August 2006

Ignored post by SunWizard posted

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I had a PM asking for more detailed pics so here are some more. Centrifuge in the barrel. The Tee before it is the pressure relief valve with a plastic elbow over it to direct the flow down:

Here is the first heater element:

Second heater element (showing the metal washers that hold the o-ring in place):

Parabolic concentrating 2'x6' solar collector (not needed with the 2 water heaters, but fun!)

Location: N. Colorado | Registered: 31 August 2006

Ignored post by SunWizard posted

canolafunola

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How practical would this be for on board filter/ dewater? Anyone working on it?

Registered: 08 May 2005

Ignored post by canolafunola posted

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Very practical, it would be easy to convert this to an onboard setup. I don't plan on doing any long trips soon where I need the onboard, but may make a portable version anyway because its easy. Use a 12volt motor on the pump. Use whatever heat source you like, coolant heat, wvo or propane fired heater, or a 110v generator powering water heater elements. Put a small fan blowing across a cross fitting (to the outside of vehicle) just below the centrifuge to help the dewatering.

If you plan on mistwashing, you need to heat first, which I do while running through the centrifuge for the first few passes. Then mistwash, leave it settle at least an hour, drain off the free water, then start the centrifuge, which would work fine even while on the road. And you can do it all in 1 tank which is what I have been doing with the barrel.

Location: N. Colorado | Registered: 31 August 2006

Ignored post by SunWizard posted

canolafunola

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Why mist wash? Shouldn't the centrifuge remove everything including food particles, carbon (from the hi temp frying), water and the soluble acids? Or does the acid stay behind?

One tank sounds great but I am having trouble visualizing how that would work. Are you drawing from and filtering into the same tank?

Registered: 08 May 2005

Ignored post by canolafunola posted

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Mist wash is because its evaporative dewatering so acids/sugars could stay behind. It works like a flash evaporator. Many people report success without doing it but I am extra careful. My mist wash water always comes out clear and neutral PH so I tend to think its not needed, but it depends on your oil source. Thats the trick, you never know if theres bad stuff in there so its safest to always wash, especially on the road with very unknown sources.

(edit- see page 12, it does dewater like a "true" centrifuge also but it keeps the water in the rotor, it may be possible to remove water/acids/etc. without a mistwash if you capture the output at pump shutoff)

Yes I draw from the bottom of the tank and centrifuge dumps into the top of the same tank and I find 4 passes through the centrifuge gets it amazingly clean.

Edit - and I calculate 4 passes like this, 30 gallons of VO, at 1gpm this runs best at, is done in 2 hours. Sometimes I do more passes than this because some time is spent heating the oil and I run through the centrifuge during this too but I don't count that since it doesn't work near as well cold.

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Location: N. Colorado | Registered: 31 August 2006

Ignored post by SunWizard posted

Mr Dieselcraft

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Posted

quote:
Originally posted by JOAT:
Finally got time to run a few real tests. The small capacity and need to run multiple passes seem to be the main drawbacks of this unit. Overall tho I like it for "polishing" the oil pre-filter. Should extend filter life considerably.

Dewatering wasn't as dramatic as SunWizard saw. There was some steam with 120-160 degree oil, but not like a flash evaporator. Seemed to me more along what you see when you splash the hot oil over an exposed surface to assist evaporation. Noticable reduction in bubbles in the pan test with each pass, but multiple passes are obviously required. I wonder if SunWizards inline heater was generating the steam that caused the sputtering sounds he heard? I'll add one tomorrow and test.

I mounted mine (pic below) with a bent 1/8" steel plate, attached with rubber grommets to wood. Seemed to cut the noise considerably, as mounted direct the barrel resonated something fierce. Also mounted with 3" drainage fittings to direct the oil and allow a ventilation system to be used to pull vapors and odors out of the garage.

Using a cold glass makes the water vapors visible. Water that condensed on the outside was not oily, but tasted like the oil smelled, perhaps indicating some of the disolved stuff evaporated with the water.

Some of the solids make it past the main bowl of the centrifuge, as indicated by the solids in the chamber where the jets are.

As you can see, there were alot of solids caught in the main chamber, 2nd pass, about 45 minutes running. Almost 1/4" thick. This was from about 15 gallons of oil I had left in the bottom of the pre-filter barrel, which had lots of settled stuff from previous runs.

I would like to thank you for the positive feed back on the Dieselcraft Centrifuge. We would like to use your photos and your comment on our web page. Awaiting your reply:-)

Registered: 14 October 2006

Ignored post by Mr Dieselcraft posted

Mr Dieselcraft

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Posted

quote:
Originally posted by SunWizard:
quote:
Originally posted by mobetta:
wizard- are you using any temp controls, or just running 2 4500 w elements on 120v= 2250 w total, @ 55 gph? any idea of exiting temps,how well it dewaters? good idea on reinforing the o-ring.

No temp controls just the 2 elements at 120v=2250w as you say. Exiting temp starts at 100F, and goes up to about 200F after 2 hours. Seems to level off around there due to losses to ambient 50F through the 55 gallon metal barrel, pipes etc.

Dewaters very well, I can see and hear the steam coming off the outlet of the centrifuge, and when it stops steaming it has passed the pan test for water each time. 3 batches so far. Seems like 4 passes through the centrifuge is a good amount for both dewater and to get the oil very clean. edit- and this is after a mist wash where I drained off most but left some visible water in the oil.

I would like to thank you also for the positive feed back on the Dieselcraft Centrifuge. We would like to use your photos and your comment on our web page. Awaiting your reply:-)

Registered: 14 October 2006

Ignored post by Mr Dieselcraft posted

canolafunola

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Mr Dieselcraft,

I am contemplating getting one to play with. Will you be offering special pricing for forum members? Where are these units made and what is their life expectancy?

Also do you see any problems using this for dual purpose?

1. lube oil filtration normally

2. After cleaning the centrifuge and switching quick coupling hoses, WVO filtering? then back to 1. after cleaning.

2 birds with one stone -

Registered: 08 May 2005

Ignored post by canolafunola posted