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Dieselcraft centrifuge works great -My filter and dewater rig
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Hi Micheal thanks for your detailed and helpful post. It did read familiar to me, maybe you have posted similar elase where or others have had similar experience.

Your test clearly shows heating oil and forcing it through jets does remove more than sufficient water.

When i CF WVO my filter can exceed OEM change intervals, i filter after the CF because the processing of WMO has proved that the Diesel Craft CF does not remove all partials as does the testing you have kindly shared with me.


Do you remember the sample size tested and at what level it was taken from in the cubie? Did you collect two cubies from one site or fill two cubies from one well mixed source? i only collect in 20lt drums but from each site the oil inside varies a lot.


WMO from my diesel is pretty bad i get as much gunk from 10lts WMO as i get from 180lts my two week settled WVO.

To help be more specific my reference to "settled" would be better said as re-setteled. I collect in 20lt drums and they sit at various times, some times a week and some i collect have been years old, then i decant them into a 205lt drum add 1 lt diesel on top then one to two weeks latter i top pump with the CF from that.

When i decant i stop when water or large amounts of gunk, lots goes in the drum but it has a base tap and as said i top pump out.

HMM just had a though given we are in different places is a cubie 1,000 lts? i know them in different places as ICBs and bulkies, i think over seas there are 20lt cardbord containers that maybe called cubies.

Your post was appreciated bless ya


Peace and Blessings
Howie
87/88 300D 210k
Near 50k on svo fuel heater thermostat by passed
GQY60 Nissam Patrol with TD42 donk. 390k near 80k Veggie
Tiger loop CAV 296 filter (retired still running never a fuel issue)
2005 Musso 150k near 15k WVO
1999 Musso 195k near 1500kms WVO
PUG 306 turbo about to be converted
 
Location: Regional South Australia  | Registered: November 11, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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My 205lt settling drum also has the steel drum trick, when i pump off the top of it i pump into another (flat bottom), then recirculate it for 5hrs, depending on start temp i go to 80 dec C.

My CF is mounted on a 20lt drum (fan fitted) that gravity feeds back to the recirculation drum (Flat bottom) then my final pass is to another drum.

If the Diesel Craft CF did the job as well as kindly described in an earlier post by Mr Dieselcraft.

quote:
If solids settle from oil at "ONE" gravity you would think that at 2000 gravities you would get the same or better effect.
If there is nothing in the rotor after the oil is exposed to gravity time 2000 for an hour then the solids in the oil defy gravity or there are no solids in the oil.


That last pass on its own would actually remove ALL partials but i would say we together have proved it does not. Both in my shed and as Micheal shared in the lab also.

I guess from this others when cleaning are finding deposits in the casting near the jets, clear simple proof some gunk is going through it remaining un captured.

Of course without the heat it would still be "wet" because Diesel Craft CFs don't remove suspended water. My testing showed me it will actually take free water and suspend it.

Micheals test and my experience shows heat works, of course there are methods for removing water ie vacumm.

Blessings to you and yours


Peace and Blessings
Howie
87/88 300D 210k
Near 50k on svo fuel heater thermostat by passed
GQY60 Nissam Patrol with TD42 donk. 390k near 80k Veggie
Tiger loop CAV 296 filter (retired still running never a fuel issue)
2005 Musso 150k near 15k WVO
1999 Musso 195k near 1500kms WVO
PUG 306 turbo about to be converted
 
Location: Regional South Australia  | Registered: November 11, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Does anyone heat their oil for their CF using only 12V?

What do you use?
 
Registered: January 16, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Howie,

Thanks for the compliment about my posts being detailed or helpful. Hey, this is fun.

First, I think that part of the DC CF is the evaporation that comes from what must be a mist inside the canister from the action of the jets. Please read on.

Here is a tip that works for us: I mentioned it to John at DC, (Mr. Dieselcraft). He was nice enough to send us a canister to experiment with. I do not have a photo where I am so I'll have to describe the "tip" as best I can. We drilled a 1/2" hole at the top of the canister. We plumbed the bottom of the CF so that there is a "T" in line with the outflow. On the branch of the "T" we made a chimney from the 1 1/4" iron pipe using an elbow, etc. and with the chimney extending above the canister. I hope this makes sense. At first we threaded a little filter into the 1/2" hole on top of the canister, then found we didn't need it. While we have a fan blowing across the top of the hot oil in the 55-gallon barrel, this setup makes a significant difference in the way the oil is flash evaporated in the canister. (Some subjective use of "significant" and "flash evaporated") You can see the water vapor coming from the chimney. After creating this setup, we experimented with pushing different velocities of air in, and pulling air out, of the 1/2" on top of the canister. The only difference in water removal that we could measure or note was when we closed the 1/2" hole - water did not leave at the same rate with the hole closed as with the hole open.

So I think it is fair to say that the CF removes water - just not through centrifugal force but through what I think must be going on, through flash evaporation (the creating of a mist of fine droplets in the canister that, through increased surface area, allow water to exit the oil) inside the canister and outside the rotor.

As to sampling. The company we used, I now remember was Lubetrak, required that we purchased kits of 12 or so plastic bottles and separate labels. Each bottle was about three fluid ounces. Having taken physical chemistry and organic chemistry in college, we knew to sample from a just-mixed 5-gallon cubie (a note to Howie: this is one of the definitions of cubie we use here in the States). Normally we collect(ed) about 10 5-gallon cubies from one of our sources. Every other cubie for a 55-gallon run was sampled before running, and a sample or two was taken from the clean and thoroughly mixed 55-gallon drum after running. Perhaps five or so samples were taken from each batch. (At about $30US per sample, it was not cheap.) I explained some of the results here. (If someone really wants (and maybe, who knows, wants to cough up some $) I can see if I can find the password to our Lubetrak login so the results could be viewed first hand. That would be a real long shot.)

JVD,

To respond to the question about the use of 12V to heat the WVO. I have not had experience with using low voltage to heat WVO. We use 4-220V 5500W placed-in-the-suction-side hot water heater elements wired to 110V to heat the oil in our setup.

Where is Sunwizard these days? I trust he is well.

All the best.

Michael
 
Location: Austin | Registered: April 22, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I am still around, just not answering the same questions I have answered many times in this thread, that are summarized in the 1st line of the 1st post.

From detailed testing over several years described there, it dewaters partly by centrifugal force and partly by flash evap. even at 160F.


YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary, see www.burnveg.com/forum
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4
Zero fossil house- 100% solar power and heat.
 
Location: N. Colorado | Registered: August 31, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by JVD:
Some say the pump will not provide enough pressure/flow at idle. Is this true, and can I just use a smaller pulley?

It will provide way too much pressure at any rpm, I don't know about flow. I agree it may not be enough and it depends on the pulleys. If you use a oberdorfer gear pump like many of us, they have spec. sheets giving pressure at every flow rate and RPM, and you could get one that would work.
quote:
Will the FPHE clog with dirty WVO?

Not if you run the WVO through a 100-200 micron screen which is also needed to avoid plugging the jets in the CF.
quote:

Will I need an extremely expensive pressure regulator to tolerate the high pressure?

No. The amount of flow is what deteremines how big of regulator you need.
quote:

Others recommended a shurflo RV water pump, but these seem to max out at 50PSI?

No, there are 100 psi models, but those don't put out enough flow.


YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary, see www.burnveg.com/forum
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4
Zero fossil house- 100% solar power and heat.
 
Location: N. Colorado | Registered: August 31, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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I was looking on ebay yesterday and thinking of you Sun. I was wondering how many of these CF"s have been sold directly through your work with the things and probably from this thread and all those that have spawned from it.

I noticed there are a load of people selling the things now and clearly many through your influence alone because all they mention is veg oil, not the type of filtration they were originally intended for.
I think you are 99% responsible in spawning a whole industry with these things.

Quite an achievement but it's a pitty you couldn't have reaped some of the profits others have made as a result of your work.
 
Registered: July 30, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I think Sun deserves an Ataboy for making the hobby safer. It's safer because with a centrifuge (either pressure driven or motor driven), you need less settling time. Less settling time means less oil in drums and totes in the back yard. Reducing the oil stored on your property reduces your exposure to out of control fires that burn down shops, homes and airport hangers.
 
Location: Cowboy Country | Registered: December 06, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Glad to see everyone is doing well, especially SunWizard, it has been a long time since this site has been as active.

Things haven't changed much for me, I still make my oil run in the centrifuge for long periods so it is very clean. I can go 20k+ without changing my vehicle filter. Add a bit of diesel and poly isn't a problem. I'm over 170k miles on vegoil now in my truck.

Take care all,

Sam


2002 F250 Vegistroke now with the new V3 module!
 
Location: Wyoming | Registered: July 25, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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for those using generators/inverters what type of motor are you using? I can't seem to find a small electric motor that doesn't have a start up surge of over 2000W
 
Registered: January 16, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hi Micheal,
sorry for taking so long to get back but i have been busy.
Your welcome on the compliment, good posts are good help.
Had a little trouble following the last one, as you said pics help.

Best i got from it you have shown that water is removed from flash evaporation.

Same conclusion i got to, without heat cold it makes a great mixer for water and oil.

I have seen some bio guys do the same thing with heat and a just a jet.

Questions for all

When you clean your CF do you get deposits on the casting toward the jets?

Does any us the CF to remove water without heat?

Does any one use the diesel craft CF with one pass?

Has any one used or seen a cheaper version of fluid driven CF?

Has any one else got coating issues in their canister?

I read some more posts that seemed to suggest a poster here developed the CF veggie oil industry.

Was the diesel craft CF made for veggie oil or made for diesel engine oil on car but never took off and were sold off cheap and then picked up on for cleaning WVO?

Bless ya all


Peace and Blessings
Howie
87/88 300D 210k
Near 50k on svo fuel heater thermostat by passed
GQY60 Nissam Patrol with TD42 donk. 390k near 80k Veggie
Tiger loop CAV 296 filter (retired still running never a fuel issue)
2005 Musso 150k near 15k WVO
1999 Musso 195k near 1500kms WVO
PUG 306 turbo about to be converted
 
Location: Regional South Australia  | Registered: November 11, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by 88300D:

Was the diesel craft CF made for veggie oil or made for diesel engine oil on car but never took off and were sold off cheap and then picked up on for cleaning WVO?



Centrifuges were used way back on Truck engines at least for oil Filtration.
A couple of years back when Visiting my uncle in the country and describing how I clean my veg oil and that I was thinking of a CF, he went into his extensive libary of workshop manuals in his garage and pulled out a manual from an early '50s " Albion" engine Chassis combination which he and his father had bought to put a bus body on.

Clearly described and Illustrated in the manual was a CF of the exact same design as the Diesel craft type. These engines had no other form of oil filtration and my uncle said that back in the day these engines and another which I think were Bedfords, had a reputation of long trouble free life which was put down to the CF's keeping the oil very clean.

Some of the other specs of the engine were interesting like the scheduled service of pulling the head every 20,000 miles for decoking. My uncle said they ran theirs a bit longer as the oils and fuel they were getting must have been a bit better and the coking wasn't so bad as to require the head coming off at those intervals but it was a " Routine" maintenance job.

CF's are also found as an OEM fitment on a lot of trucks, earthmoving and large stationary equipment which of course is the intended use of the Dieselcraft's.

I think in the case of Diesel craft, They just got lucky beyond belief and someone in the form of sun found a use for their product they never knew about and probably doubled or better their sales with no expense or effort on their part.

What a windfall for the company that would have been!
 
Registered: July 30, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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Hi Ttommy,
thanks for your post,
as said i know that for WVO landrover CFs are cheap alternative.

I guess from an engine oil perspective with an diesel craft aftermarket fit it would divert some flow that in an OEM environment manufactures design for.

blessings to you and yours


Peace and Blessings
Howie
87/88 300D 210k
Near 50k on svo fuel heater thermostat by passed
GQY60 Nissam Patrol with TD42 donk. 390k near 80k Veggie
Tiger loop CAV 296 filter (retired still running never a fuel issue)
2005 Musso 150k near 15k WVO
1999 Musso 195k near 1500kms WVO
PUG 306 turbo about to be converted
 
Location: Regional South Australia  | Registered: November 11, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hey guys,

Thanks in advance for your help.

Is anyone in this thread from Ontario, Canada or close by the greater toronto area?

I would love some help setting up a DC CF setup.

I was in Los Angeles, a few weeks ago visiting my grand parents. I went to the homedepot and found
nickel plated 4500 water heating elements (I can only find copper ones in Toronto). The heating elements were the right size but I couldn`t find the straight tubes and T connectors. I`m basically finding it hard to find the parts. I

In return I can give an honorarium or a family portrait (I`m studying photography at university).

Failing finding someone near by, I would like to give some one an honorarium, to setup the cf system.
I need the plumbing done, heaters , automatic thermostat to turn (2) heating elements off when temp. is too high (this could be a complicated thermostat or just a simple snap disc limit control (that turns on at 160F and off at 190F), pressure guage right before cf, and before that the bypass valve which is connected to the
over pressure relief valve. Following Sunwizard`s design, I would also like a by pass valve right after
the pump, so I can filter 1-2 micron once more, and then straight into gas tank or jerry can.


Basically, I`ll send you a Bank Draft, to setup everything minus cutting a hole in 55 gallon drum,
attaching the CF, attaching the motor/pump, and attaching the pump input to a conical bottom (from the 55 gallon drum). I will buy online the parts needed and will have them shipped to you first.
If you can tally up how much you spent on other parts I`ll make sure the bank draft will take this into account.


If your interested in helping out, please give me an idea how much the honorarium should be.


Here are some of the exmples I found. I read the thread from page 60 all the way to the end.
So I'm not being lazy here, I just don't have the mechanical engineering skills needed.




]

Thanks in advance for your time, consideration, and help.

Cheers,
Kevin H.
 
Registered: January 12, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hi Folks,
And Kudos from wayback mainly to Sun who inspired me to build a centrifugal cleaner.
I haven't visited this site for years after having bought my centrifuge in 2007.
Just a note to say that I purchased the Filterfuge FF-60 from Industrial Diesel Prod's in Canada for my ops and it has performed very well all these years. I remember hearing though that some folks had all kinds of problems with them. This past week I cleaned some oil that I knew was terribly contaminated and was able to smoke off enough water to be acceptable to throw in the mix. (I just check it with the fry pan method on the stove and make sure there are next to no more bubbles...)There was really solid steam coming out of the barrel! I always wondered if there was water vapor or just oil vapor coming out but certainly there was a lot of water vapor. The final filters in the whicles seem to cover the rest.
Will be taking a 1,200 mi trip over Easter in our converted Army surplus pickup truck (CUCV M1008) which is routine. I have about 45K veggie miles on it and have driven it from LA to CT pulling a trailer.

Again thanks to all who have made it easier and better by their contributions to this site. Especially cleaning!!!
Michael
 
Location: CA | Registered: December 04, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by qes:
Hey guys,

Thanks in advance for your help.

Is anyone in this thread from Ontario, Canada or close by the greater toronto area?

I would love some help setting up a DC CF setup.

I was in Los Angeles, a few weeks ago visiting my grand parents. I went to the homedepot and found
nickel plated 4500 water heating elements (I can only find copper ones in Toronto). The heating elements were the right size but I couldn`t find the straight tubes and T connectors. I`m basically finding it hard to find the parts. I

In return I can give an honorarium or a family portrait (I`m studying photography at university).

Failing finding someone near by, I would like to give some one an honorarium, to setup the cf system.
I need the plumbing done, heaters , automatic thermostat to turn (2) heating elements off when temp. is too high (this could be a complicated thermostat or just a simple snap disc limit control (that turns on at 160F and off at 190F), pressure guage right before cf, and before that the bypass valve which is connected to the
over pressure relief valve. Following Sunwizard`s design, I would also like a by pass valve right after
the pump, so I can filter 1-2 micron once more, and then straight into gas tank or jerry can.


Basically, I`ll send you a Bank Draft, to setup everything minus cutting a hole in 55 gallon drum,
attaching the CF, attaching the motor/pump, and attaching the pump input to a conical bottom (from the 55 gallon drum). I will buy online the parts needed and will have them shipped to you first.
If you can tally up how much you spent on other parts I`ll make sure the bank draft will take this into account.


If your interested in helping out, please give me an idea how much the honorarium should be.


Here are some of the exmples I found. I read the thread from page 60 all the way to the end.
So I'm not being lazy here, I just don't have the mechanical engineering skills needed.




]

Thanks in advance for your time, consideration, and help.

Cheers,
Kevin H.


IMO If you're going to get into this you'll want to learn about the system and put it together.. you'll find out it's really pretty simple.

Not sure about in Canada, but down here any hardware store will have 95% of what you need. A lot will cut and thread the black pipe for you too.

If you can't find it locally, you can get it on the internet.
 
Registered: January 16, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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