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Dieselcraft centrifuge works great -My filter and dewater rig
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It has been a while . . .

We remain in Grenada, West Indies, and now are closer than ever to a beta run on our setup. It is similar to our system in the States so I am hoping for the best. One issue that remains is getting a small 50 Hz motor here to run the Oberdorfer - I may have to bring one back from home.

We have collected used oil here and will continue. But there is a real problem here with the disposal of waste motor oil here as they dump it on the ground, usually near where the oil is being changed. (Most veggie oil goes to the dump.) If we can, I would like to utilize this used motor oil just for environmental reasons. My question: Can any of you guys recommend a forum to learn more about the filtration and use of waste motor oil? In a similar way to cleaning used veggie oil, can we use our filtering setup to clean the motor oil? Or, if anyone has had experience with the filtration or use of waste motor oil in a vehicle, could you connect with me with a private message?

I would like to help out here in any way that I can as the standard of living for most Grenadians is not good.

Thanks in advance.

Michael
 
Location: Austin | Registered: April 22, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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The centrifuge works just as well on motor oil...it will not know the difference.

Use the same process, heat to 160F and run the centrifuge 4-5 passes.

People tell us 50/50 mix works in most applications.

If we can help more email sales@dieselcraft.com

ImageCarbon_from_motor_oil_120519.jpg (21 Kb, 31 downloads) Soot from motor oil
 
Registered: October 14, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Using this system for used motor oil

I am using this system on either used transmition fluid or used motor oil using the diesel craft centerfuge i am running it at mix of 20% diesel fuel to 80% oil

Also on a side note if your living in the third world i am sure power as in electric is intermentant what you might look into is use it to run a genrator if you can find a lister or listeroid they will run on strieght oil be in motor or vegi oil if you use motor oil you have to clean out the precombuston chamber

If i can be anymore help contact me

yours lordsteven1st at gmail
 
Location: southwest Mo | Registered: March 13, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Thanks for the centrifuge setup information. Bought mine 9 months ago and have processed about 250 gallons ready to burn WVO. I found it works best if I run all my WVO through a cold upflow settling system similar to this LINK. I think this because I have let centrifuge spin 45 gallons over 12 hours and get under two table spoons of sludge out. If I rush the settling system the centrifuge will have a cup of sludge in it. That is my 2¢ and thanks for the priceless advice. Truck runs great!
 
Location: Bath Maine | Registered: March 20, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I've read through this thread in pieces numerous times.

I'm planning on making an on-board filtration system using. My plan is to belt drive a 80's Acura PS pump under the hood, then heat the WVO with the largest FPHE I can find.

I know that this has been discussed many times, but also from reading this forum it seems like there are many different opinions on it.

Some say the pump will not provide enough pressure/flow at idle. Is this true, and can I just use a smaller pulley?

Will the FPHE clog with dirty WVO?

Will I need an extremely expensive pressure regulator to tolerate the high pressure?

Others recommended a shurflo RV water pump, but these seem to max out at 50PSI?

I like the idea of using the coolant, and motor... but am trying to weigh out the cost of actually making it work.
 
Registered: January 16, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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JVD,

In response to your ideas about on-board filtration:

I am not familiar with making a pump work under the hood so I cannot comment. We use "designed for doing this" Oberdorfer pumps.

I do know that regulating pressure is not difficult and Grainger has an adjustable pressure regulator mentioned in this thread and it cost about $20.

I can also comment on the FPHE which I think will become ineffective with contaminants from the dirty oil. I have seen exchangers that work with fluids and exhaust gas. The internals for the fluid are larger that the flat plates and would not become "clogged" as easily. I have not used this type of exchanger so I cannot comment more.

If I were doing this I would use a hose in hose to warm the oil, pass the oil through a series of strainers,then heat it electrically, and on to the centrifuge. Each pass would follow the same route until the oil was partially clean, perhaps two hours, and then a three-way valve would direct the semi-clean oil around the strainers as they would become ineffective and possibly add contaminants.

I hope this helps.

Michael

This message has been edited. Last edited by: veggieguy,
 
Location: Austin | Registered: April 22, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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I know of the pressure regulator's you're talking about.. but I believe the pressure of a power steering pump when the crank is at 4000 RPM is much higher than what they can tolerate. Not positive though which is why I asked.
 
Registered: January 16, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I was using waste motor oil to see how it goes but the centrifuge does not remove al lot of contaminants. I found after a five hour cycle i put some in a jar and left it to settle, heaps of sediment. No doubt it did remove a lot more but it just does not get it all. I resorted to filtering it on the last cycle. Give how much the fuge did not remove i now last pass filter my WVO.
Also for others i also tried WMO WVO mixes but if i stored it it separated at some level, gold on top black on the bottom.
Hope this helps
Bless ya


Peace and Blessings
Howie
87/88 300D 210k
Near 50k on svo fuel heater thermostat by passed
GQY60 Nissam Patrol with TD42 donk. 390k near 80k Veggie
Tiger loop CAV 296 filter (retired still running never a fuel issue)
2005 Musso 150k near 15k WVO
1999 Musso 195k near 1500kms WVO
PUG 306 turbo about to be converted
 
Location: Regional South Australia  | Registered: November 11, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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HMM clean as you go is a cracker idea. I dont know how it could be set up to flash water of given the fuge does not remove it, it is the heat that flashes it off to atmosphere.

I purchased one from what i read in this thread and given i can access low viscosity oils tested it as a de waterer with no heat. It just mixed the water and oil.

Worth noting my fuge reference is for the diesel craft.

Bless ya


Peace and Blessings
Howie
87/88 300D 210k
Near 50k on svo fuel heater thermostat by passed
GQY60 Nissam Patrol with TD42 donk. 390k near 80k Veggie
Tiger loop CAV 296 filter (retired still running never a fuel issue)
2005 Musso 150k near 15k WVO
1999 Musso 195k near 1500kms WVO
PUG 306 turbo about to be converted
 
Location: Regional South Australia  | Registered: November 11, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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88300D,

I am hoping others will respond to your post about the CF not doing its job to clean the motor oil. I will be interested in the responses.

My comment: You note that the WVO and the WMO are immiscible. Perhaps adding diesel will allow the solution to be homogenous as both the WVO and WMO are soluble in diesel. I have not tried adding WMO and WVO at the same time to the same tank.

Best.

Michael
 
Location: Austin | Registered: April 22, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hi Michael,
The CF does collect contaminants and it may be wise not to have too higher expectations, thats where i started due to this thread (i read it as the CF removes water) and it disappointing me given when i purchased it was a big investment, near more than the car i was putting the fuel in at that time.

Worth noting is it did not clog my car filters, i worry large amounts of particles smaller than the filter removes under heat and pressure may cause shorter IP life.

Also worth noting i filter with 3 nominal 95% 1 micron filters and still i can settle and get some sediment.

When i ran WVO WMO mixes they seemed fine while driving but the separation was noted in storage.

I again gave up on WMO and some time later running WVO 10% ULP 1% diesel blend blocked a filter on my car, what came out of the filter looked exactly the same as the sediment in my storage drums.

Being a blender in cold times i have used both ULP / RUG and diesel as to say for sure i blended WMO and diesel i could not say for sure as i was not paying attention assuming that ULP & diesel blending would be the same for WMO and WVO.

I use a lot of fuel and am lucky to still get enough WVO.

I was keen on WMO to use my own waste and thought if WVO was not available to me i would have an alternate fuel source.

I have done the WMO twice and while i can get significantly more KMs to the tank the mess turns me off.

Blessings to you and yours


Peace and Blessings
Howie
87/88 300D 210k
Near 50k on svo fuel heater thermostat by passed
GQY60 Nissam Patrol with TD42 donk. 390k near 80k Veggie
Tiger loop CAV 296 filter (retired still running never a fuel issue)
2005 Musso 150k near 15k WVO
1999 Musso 195k near 1500kms WVO
PUG 306 turbo about to be converted
 
Location: Regional South Australia  | Registered: November 11, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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If solids settle from oil at "ONE" gravity you would think that at 2000 gravities you would get the same or better effect.

If there is nothing in the rotor after the oil is exposed to gravity time 2000 for an hour then the solids in the oil defy gravity or there are no solids in the oil.

See the attached.

ImageCarbon_from_motor_oil_120519.jpg (21 Kb, 13 downloads) Soot remved form motor oil via Dieselcraft Centrifuge
 
Registered: October 14, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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quote:
If solids settle from oil at "ONE" gravity you would think that at 2000 gravities you would get the same or better effect.
I agree with the last part that it should be 2000 times better on paper and likely in a mechanical CF but as stated have proved it not to be the case with the diesel craft.

I checked out the CF and the coating i guess nickle that is pitted or gone is ok on all the meeting surfaces.

If the diesel craft CF could truly do what is quoted then we would only need one pass. It does not collect all the solids 100%. Additional evidence of this is that my CF also needs cleaning down by the jets, if it had captured them they would still be on the wall of the CF canister.

I guess all fluid driven CFs without rotor plates/ cones dont actually remove all heavy solids, this is based on the poor performance of my diesel craft OC-50.

The pic only shows what was captured not what remains, i have no dispute that it does remove some contaminates.

From this i suggest the above quote is applying the description of an apple to an orange.

Not having a go at you just thinking it through and sharing.

I declare have and have never had no financial interest in any equipment discussed other than my investment.

I also am no expert and can only speak for my long use of the equipment.

If i was to start over i would not buy one, i would settle for at least a week top pump or decanter, heat de-water with a jet and use filters, that way i could process much faster and reduce capital.

Given the poor quality of the diesel craft lacks in the rust coating I would maybe consider getting one of the cheap versions that i have been told are on the web given CFs after initial outlay reduce filter consumption. It is possible cheapies are even poorer quality, not that i have seen one. Soon after i purchased DC CF i was offered an OEM one of a Landrover second hand for $50 that would make another great lower cost alternative.

Given how expensive the diesel craft is and filters are so cheap i doubt i would ever get ahead.

If money was not an issue i would get a mechanical CF so the quote in this post may stand true.

Blessings to you and yours


Peace and Blessings
Howie
87/88 300D 210k
Near 50k on svo fuel heater thermostat by passed
GQY60 Nissam Patrol with TD42 donk. 390k near 80k Veggie
Tiger loop CAV 296 filter (retired still running never a fuel issue)
2005 Musso 150k near 15k WVO
1999 Musso 195k near 1500kms WVO
PUG 306 turbo about to be converted
 
Location: Regional South Australia  | Registered: November 11, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Howie,

I might be able to speak to the difference between 2-month old settled oil and the same having run through our cycle of centrifuging. A typical CF cleaning protocol for us involves turning the heat off when reaching 220 degrees and an overall run time of about 5 hours.

From memory from more years ago than I want to remember:

We ran a series of about six tests over a period of a year. The control was easy as we just used every other container from the same batch we collected - one cubie went to the CF and one was untouched.

A Karl Fisher test was run at a lab in Utah. This test is for water and showed the CF'd oil to have about 100ppm of water compared to close to 1000ppm in the settled. I believe the German standard for veggie oil is 500ppm.

The particulates were measured from the same samples as the Karl Fisher using the same test that is used to test particulates in hydraulic fluid. I cannot remember the ASTM number. (We tried at the time to create this as a standard in the WVO community without success. Though at the time there was at least one major supplier who utilized the same test.) The test measures particulates of several size ranges and gives results in the # of particulates in each of several different micron ranges. The results were significantly (subjective word here) different in each of the categories of micron size with the CF'd oil having less in each micron range.

Couple of notes:

1. We are hobbyists and not professionals.

2. The miles we got out of the on-board filter in our vehicles, and in the vehicles of the several people we sold our clean WVO to, was changed from give-or-take 1000 - 2000 miles to over 5000 miles. We were able to change on board WVO filters at the same time we changed the crankcase filter and do it as a regular maintenance item and not as dictated by an ill-running engine.

3. Even with all the filtering we did through the DC CF with the protocol mentioned above we still ended up being able to see sediment at the bottom of the clean containers in which we stored our processed oil. This was much less than less than pea-sized fine sediment per 55-gallons and could be easily seen in the bottom of the translucent containers. The settling occurred after weeks to months.

4. A "Disclaimer": At the time we did all these tests, we had no financial connect to Dieselcraft except as buyers. Now we rep (informally) their products, though I don't believe we have sold more than one CF in the two or three years we have "repped".

5. We have not run similar tests to the above for WMO. Our experience with WMO is very limited.

Michael

This message has been edited. Last edited by: veggieguy,
 
Location: Austin | Registered: April 22, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Even with all the filtering we did we still ended up being able to see sediment


Michael, this doesn't include the oil that went through the DC unit?
 
Location: New Zealand | Registered: August 15, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Paulus,

I changed the wording in my comment, above. Hopefully it is now clear that the sediment occurred after the oil was processed through the DC CF. We use an OC-50.

Best.

Michael

This message has been edited. Last edited by: veggieguy,
 
Location: Austin | Registered: April 22, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Did I read correctly... did the CF have a deflector inside? There are differences from one manufactured centrifuge to another:


  • Presence of deflector
  • Does the deflector seal with the rotor bowl
  • What size are the jets - smaller jets = lower flow but better dwell = better efficiency
  • Some CF are dynamically balanced
  • Some CF have viton seals - others butyl rubber


In addition, the match between the gear pump and the fuge has a significant effect. Ideally a conical tank should be used with suction coming off the bottom of the cone, there should be very little oil returned to tank via the regulator (lever ball valve). Any return should be directed to the bottom of the tank (so one way to do this is have a return tube that enters the top of the tank and runs all the way to the bottom and sits in the cone). A big mistake would be to have the pump pull up via a foot valve on a flat drum. The bottom inch or so is not effectively cleaned.

Excellent results can be achieved with using this optimal configuration. Some water can be also removed using a fuge, but the problem is that, although this separates in the bowl it has a tendency to run back to tank, especially when the fuge slows. If the deflector seals the rotor bowl and is separated for cleaning away from the tank, then some water can be removed. I'm planning to set up an inverted CF configured so that the fuge's discharge is via a ball valve allowing it to be diverted to a separate tank on slow down. Nevertheless, if you want to use an oil pressured fuge, it's best for removing solids. A final polishing / drying pot is effective at bring down water ppms to <500.
 
Location: UK | Registered: February 10, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Nathan,

I am not sure that I understand your comment or question about a deflector as I do not know the part you describe or I do not know it by that name. Our CF is a standard off-the-shelf DC CF. Does their OC-50 have a deflector? If it does, then we are using a deflector.

We do not share your experience with water removal. Perhaps our oil is not as contaminated with water or perhaps our protocol to heat the oil to water's boiling point makes a difference. We originally set up a three-way valve under the CF to direct the water held in the rotor away from the clean oil in the drum. But, though the "full flow" three-way remains, we have never used it in the 10's of thousands of gallons of WVO we have processed.

As a side note, we belled the bottom of our tank. It seems to work well. We used the same method that is used to make the musical instruments called steel drums, and then inverted the "bell" we created. I believe this was suggested somewhere in this thread and someone used a bowling ball to do the inverting.

Hope this helps about water removal. I would love to hear from others about water, too.

Best.

Michael

This message has been edited. Last edited by: veggieguy,
 
Location: Austin | Registered: April 22, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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I use one bucket with CF,after some time when I think that is OK I pick up from CF to ANOTHER bucket so oil isn`t mix,did you do that way?


sorry for my English
KEEP IT SIMPLE ALWAYS if YOU CAN
 
Location: Europe | Registered: February 09, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Mtrans,

Our CF exits into the same barrel from beginning to end.

I hope this answers your question.

Michael
 
Location: Austin | Registered: April 22, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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