Hey all, especially you experts,

We are running our first real batch of 40 gallons right now. We have run small test runs of about 15 gallons to be sure that all is well. We started with decently clean oil (dark amber with nothing larger than 25 microns).

My question(s): The OC-50 is pretty consistently making a rattling sound coming from the inside. It is less noisy than say, a blender, but is not the humming sound it has made before. Does this indicate that it is time to clean the centrifuge? Is this fine to go on for a few hours? Is there something else that we should be doing?

THANK YOU!

Michael

P.S. The solution to the problem that I was having with the restriction of an 1 1/4" 3-way valve was solved by putting in a "T" to vent the output. My thanks again to all, especially RickDaTech and Walexa07.

quote:

Originally posted by veggieguy:
The OC-50 is pretty consistently making a rattling sound coming from the inside. It is less noisy than say, a blender, but is not the humming sound it has made before. Does this indicate that it is time to clean the centrifuge? Is this fine to go on for a few hours? Is there something else that we should be doing?

Hi Michael,

I have two rotors for my OC-50, one seems to rattle a bit more than the other, but both rattle until they get up to speed, then the hum over takes the rattle. I don't let them get real dirty since it gets harder to clean them when the goop gets compressed and hardens. You should clean it and try again to see if it sounds the same. I'm assuming you have it up to 90 psi too?

Sam

Sam,

Yes, an Oberdorfer 991 keeps the pressure at a consistent 90 pounds even when the temp is about 160 degrees.

No matter if the centrifuge is clean or not, the rattle remains. I am thinking that I will contact Mr. Dieselcraft and get his take on the rattle, too. (I have lined up the marks to be sure that it is put back together correctly.)

Sam, or anyone: Any ideas on what to do to lessen the noise? Could it indicate that some harm is happening?

One other question, when the filtering is done, the oil is nice and transparent with a golden color. After cooling to room temperature, the oil hazes a bit. I have been spinning the centrifuge for about 2 - 3 hours. There littel or no more sediment in the bowl in the last hour. Should I do more maybe?

Michael

Mr. Dieselcraft,

Any ideas on the posts regarding the rattling noise? Dangerous? A bad sign? (I listened to your You Tube entry with the OC-20 and did not hear any rattling.) The unit is new and has not been abused.

Any help would be most appreciated.

Michael

If the oil gets a haze when it cools I would guess there is some water in it.

quote:

Originally posted by Raften:
If the oil gets a haze when it cools I would guess there is some water in it.

Hi Raften,

It really depends on the type of oil, or even a mixture of oil from different restaurants.

I pick up mostly hydrogenated oils, and even when its completely dry after the CF it is still creamy at room temp.

Sam

Sam

quote:

Originally posted by veggieguy:
No matter if the centrifuge is clean or not, the rattle remains. I am thinking that I will contact Mr. Dieselcraft and get his take on the rattle, too. (I have lined up the marks to be sure that it is put back together correctly.)

Good idea email him at: sales(at)dieselcraft(dot)com

quote:

Any ideas on what to do to lessen the noise?

Maybe noise is too subjective, mine is noisy when you stand next to it, but it is in the garage so you can hardly hear it from the house. So, I'm not sure how much more or less your CF is producing noise than mine. But, I'll have mine going the day after tomorrow, if you want, I'll call you, or you call me, and you can listen over the phone if that would help you. I know mine is doing its job as it has for months.

quote:

Could it indicate that some harm is happening?

Do you see some wear, or bump marks on the rotor?

quote:

One other question, when the filtering is done, the oil is nice and transparent with a golden color. After cooling to room temperature, the oil hazes a bit. I have been spinning the centrifuge for about 2 - 3 hours. There little or no more sediment in the bowl in the last hour. Should I do more maybe?

Your CF is an OC-50 correct? And you are cleaning 45 gallon batches, or do you have a larger tank?

First, regarding the haze, it depends on the type of oil, and how cool is cool.

In that last hour you haven't really gone through the entire batch since it is constantly mixing and if your oil is relatively clean when you start it wouldn't be too surprising you don't see a lot of sediment in that last hour. To put it in perspective, if I run my oil for 48 hours, on an 80 gallon batch, cleaning the rotor 4 times, I can start hour 49 with a clean rotor, run for another 8 hours and get just shy of another teaspoon of black deposit. (the value of removing that last bit with the CF is debatable, but it's in the oil and it doesn't burn in your engine)


Sam
Wyoming

Gang,

I am about to order a OC-50 Here is my design. Pick it apart. Tell me where I am wrong.

I am going to use the centrifuge for BD production for both its dewatering/flash evaporation and for its particle removal. I need to process 120 gallons / week, but I don’t want to spend every weekend in the bio-shed processing oil. (actually the bio shed is called ‘the litter box’ on account of the quantity of kitty litter everywhere.) I’ll do some filtering down to ten or even one micron and then move the oil into the 275 gallon tank where the centrifuge can continually clean the oil for days on end. It is my intent to start the centrifuge up and check on it every few hours in the beginning to clean the rotor, but then after the first day check on it before/after work and just let it run autonomously. I figure two to three days of continual filtering will give me clean and more importantly, dry wvo. From there I’ll process once every other week.

Is there a need to plumb with pipe greater than ½ inch - since that is the input on the centrifuge and the output on the bottom of the tank?

Pump: It looks like folks favor the Oberdorfer style. I’m flexible there.

Looking for a critique. While the attached drawing isn't exactly to scale, you should get the general idea.

Thanks

Greg

centrifuge.jpg (37 KB, 80 downloads)

Looks good except the thermostat should be mounted touching the top of the heaters pipe. This way even if the pump shuts off, then the heaters shut off instead of overheating.

You only need to filter to 100 microns before the CF, any lower is a waste of filters since the CF will remove it better. You probably won't need to run it for several days, since bio is thinner than VO it should filter and dewater much faster.

1/2 plumbing is fine except after that CF you need 1.25"

Thank you for reviewing it.

In your notes on xycworks.com, specifically when plumed to a hot water heater, you have the output of the CF going right into the tank with a vent hanging off the side. I assume the vent is there for evaporation purposes? Can I plum directly back into the tank or is the open funnel idea a better one?

I am going to be using the CF before I process for BD. So it will be cleaning the VO before I turn it into BD. Who knows, I may also just use some straight VO in my tractor during the summer months. It is the dewatering aspect of the CF that has me the most intrigued.

quote:

Good idea email him at: sales(at)dieselcraft(dot)com

Mr. D. wrote me and is going to change out my rotor. (Great service and response.)

QUOTE] Any ideas on what to do to lessen the noise?[/QUOTE]
I'll have mine going the day after tomorrow, if you want, I'll call you, or you call me, and you can listen over the phone if that would help you. [/QUOTE]

No need to call as I will get a new rotor and then I can determine is there is excess noise.

Do you see some wear, or bump marks on the rotor?

No.

quote:

One other question, when the filtering is done, the oil is nice and transparent with a golden color. After cooling to room temperature, the oil hazes a bit. I have been spinning the centrifuge for about 2 - 3 hours. There little or no more sediment in the bowl in the last hour. Should I do more maybe?

Your CF is an OC-50 correct? And you are cleaning 45 gallon batches, or do you have a larger tank?

First, regarding the haze, it depends on the type of oil, and how cool is cool.

In that last hour you haven't really gone through the entire batch since it is constantly mixing and if your oil is relatively clean when you start it wouldn't be too surprising you don't see a lot of sediment in that last hour. To put it in perspective, if I run my oil for 48 hours, on an 80 gallon batch, cleaning the rotor 4 times, I can start hour 49 with a clean rotor, run for another 8 hours and get just shy of another teaspoon of black deposit. (the value of removing that last bit with the CF is debatable, but it's in the oil and it doesn't burn in your engine) [/QUOTE]

I thought that 2 -3 hours was enough with ny OC 50 and 40 or so gallons. (I'll check back through the posts to get a handle on this.) 40 hours! wow. The cloudiness ocurs in a small sample jar when it reaches room temperature. Other thoughts?

My thanks again to all.

Michael

quote:

Originally posted by veggieguy:
Mr. D. wrote me and is going to change out my rotor. (Great service and response.)

DieselCraft has great service, and it certainly adds to the value of their products.

Sam
Wyoming

quote:

Originally posted by Gregory Kittredge:
Thank you for reviewing it.

Greg,

(I just noticed my first comments to you have not been posted, I'll give it some time then repost. But my comment below assumes you saw my first response.)

Something I neglected to add. You should consider buying a second rotor, that way you can switch them out and restart the CF, then clean the dirty rotor at your convenience. In fact, it helps to soak the dirty CF in hot soapy water for a couple hours before scrubbing out the goop with a plastic pot scrubber. (Dry good and squirt WD-40 through the jets and you'll be ready to do the switch again.

You should plan on doing the first cleaning after the first 2-4 hours after the start, then you'll have a good idea how long you can let it go before the second cleaning.

Sam

quote:

You only need to filter to 100 microns before the CF, any lower is a waste of filters since the CF will remove it better. You probably won't need to run it for several days, since bio is thinner than VO it should filter and dewater much faster.

I know I have a CF slightly larger that you OC50. (SpinClean FF60) I believe the Nozzels in your 50 are considerbly larger than the OC20, if like mine they will pass a piece of 14 gauge copper, to clean them. Then you can do a lot corser job of presreening prior to your Cf. I use the following from McMaster Carr

Part # 98755K54
(Same as 98755K14)
Mini PVC/Stainless Steel Suction Strainer 30 Mesh, Fits 3/4" NPT Male, 304 SS Screen
In stock at $3.12 Each

The above screen is all I pump my oil threw when filling my CF drum.

Your milage may vary depending on the pressure applied to the consumtion peddle!

Ken In Central NY

quote:

Originally posted by Gregory Kittredge:
I assume the vent is there for evaporation purposes? Can I plum directly back into the tank or is the open funnel idea a better one?

The open funnel is much better for evaporation, and how I operate it most of the time. Open is not good for a mobile holy grail version or water heater which is the pic you are referring to.

I ran a test on the CF today. I mixed 2 heaping tablespoon of salt into 12 oz hot water and poured it into a ½ full cubie of previously filtered WVO and shook it up till emulsified. I tasted a droplet of the concoction on the tip of my tongue and could definitely taste the salt. I then CF this ½ cubie of wvo salt water emulsion at 160F till there was no more water vapors from flash evaporation. Then captured rotor on shutdown and this is what I drained out of it.


The white flakes tasted very salty. There was very little free water. Most of the 12 oz of salt water was flash evaporated, not captured in the rotor.


I took the rotor apart and found more salt.


I ran the CF for another 45 min to see how much more salt would be captured and got a little more.

This is good news.

I was going to do sugar next but I know what the outcome would be so I think I am going to skip it and do vinegar next.

Edit:
I drained the CF'ed oil into a clean cubie and will let it settle then taste the bottom and see if any more salt.

quote:

Originally posted by canolafunola:
I ran a test on the CF today. I mixed 2 heaping tablespoon of salt into 12 oz hot water and poured it into a ½ full cubie...
I ran the CF for another 45 min to see how much more salt would be captured and got a little more.

This is good news.

I was going to do sugar next but I know what the outcome would be so I think I am going to skip it and do vinegar next.

Interesting Canola, so do you figure you recovered the two tablespoons of salt?

I have a Mexican restaurant that just started using some spice that is very fine, easily plugs my pre-wash screen and burns my eyes when I stand over a warm batch of it. I just finished loading the last of 150 gallons I picked up on Sunday. I think I'm going to need to do something a little different to make it easier and quicker to remove the spice.

So will my truck run hot on capsaicin oil? <g>

Sam

quote:

Interesting Canola, so do you figure you recovered the two tablespoons of salt?

No way to tell since the salt is in a different form than it went in. It went in as crystals, it came out a different color. Maybe it's more concentrated (compacted). I'll let the oil settle a week or so then taste the bottom and see.

I did taste the CF'd oil and did not taste salt.

Question: Do you run the oil through a polishing filter after CF? If so, what micron and how long does the filter last?

quote:

Originally posted by canolafunola:
Question: Do you run the oil through a polishing filter after CF? If so, what micron and how long does the filter last?

If by polishing filter you mean multiple cycles through a filter? Than the answer is no. After the CF I move to a holding tank unfiltered, or pump into my truck or cubies, filtered through a 2 then 1 micron filter.

Last spring I cut a couple of those filters open and the were perfectly clean, so I haven't replaced the two since, and they've had 2-3 thousand gallons run through them.

Unless someone knows of 1 micron absolute filters cheaper than 50 dollars, I don't think I'd save money cutting the CF time and relying on a filter. However, we are slowly moving, and our new place doesn't have a garage, so I'm going to turn part of an old calving barn into an oil processing barn, the problem is there is no electricity so I figure I'll be running everything off a generator (on vegoil), this will change the price of electricity and make a 1 micron filter a better value.

One thing kind of bothers me, I'm not sure that the ultra fine particles that are removed during the last half of my CF runs would get filtered out by a 1 micron absolute filter. And that begs the question; How much/what effect does a teaspoon of non-combustible carbon per 80 gallons have on a vehicle. How much gets blown out the exhaust and how much ends up in the engine oil? I'm sure the answer would depend on the vehicle, but for now I'm happy to error on the clean side.

Sorry, I kind'a drifted subject wise on this one.

Sam

It's been my understanding that oil when circulated through the CF for a sufficient amount of time is going to "polish" it to something around .5 micron and that doing so is most likely not necessary. What is the range of filtering ability in fuel filters?

quote:

Originally posted by canolafunola:

quote:

Interesting Canola, so do you figure you recovered the two tablespoons of salt?

No way to tell since the salt is in a different form than it went in. It went in as crystals, it came out a different color. Maybe it's more concentrated (compacted). I'll let the oil settle a week or so then taste the bottom and see.

I did taste the CF'd oil and did not taste salt.

Question: Do you run the oil through a polishing filter after CF? If so, what micron and how long does the filter last?